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nafex - Re: [NAFEX] cider apples.

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  • From: "Dennis Norton" <dmnorton@royaloakfarmorchard.com>
  • To: "North American Fruit Explorers" <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [NAFEX] cider apples.
  • Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 17:50:34 -0600

Thought someone might find http://mtvernon.wsu.edu/frt_hort/ciderapples.htm#list useful!

Dennis Norton
Royal Oak Farm Orchard
http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.com
http://www.theorchardkeeper.blogspot.com
----- Original Message ----- From: "loneroc" <loneroc@mwt.net>
To: "North American Fruit Explorers" <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 6:29 AM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] cider apples.


Hi Tanis,

No is the simple answer to your question, if you are referring to a cider
made with only one apple. One wants a balance of acid, sweet (for the
alcohol) and tannins among other things. Bud 118 is just a source of tannin
to blend with a mix of other apples that allows one to prevent the acid
levels from getting too high in the finished product. It is not as high in
sugar as some of the 'bittersweet' European cider apples, which is a
drawback, but at least it give some tannins without having to increase acid
to objectionable levels as one can easily do when using crabs as the source
of tannins. (Apples are not the only potential source of tannins--some
Eastern European fermented beverages used various species of Sorbus to be
blended with apple juice). Apples which make good single variety cider in a
European style are usually in the 'bittersharp' category. None of the
European cultivars of either the b-sweet or b-sharp categories are
completely hardy in zone 3 or perhaps even zone 4 conditions to my knowledge
though I have hopes for a couple I'm testing. Several New England
orchardists are testing many European cultivars but without the addition of
Russian or crabapple genes I'd be surprised if any will take prolonged super
cold temperatures.

There are some 'American' cider apples that make superior single variety
ciders,'Golden Russet' comes to mind. (One of) the first American apple
selection, 'Roxbury Russet' (not hardy in zone 4 by the way) originated as a
cider apple. Indeed, the vaaaaaaaaaast majority of apples cultivated in the
US were used to make cider up to the mid 19th century and beyond.
Prohibition rang in the death knell for cider as the pre-eminent American
beverage, even though farmhouse New England cider was exempted from some of
the restrictions place on most other alcoholic beverages. Homemade
sacramental wine was also off the hit-list.

While European cider makers used select apple cultivars for a source of
juice generally, the Yankees generally used seedling apples for the same.
Johnny Appleseed was not planting dessert apples. If my memory serves, he
was a member of some oddball religious group that advocated more healthful
lifestyles (in their own minds) generally and use of cider rather than
distilled beverages in particular. Apple seedlings typically have higher
levels of acid and tannins than dessert cultivars and wildlings are often
recommended for home cidermakers today. The big yellow apple (did it have a
rose blush, too?) find of yours that I tasted has higher tannin levels than
most dessert apples--probably at similar levels to 'Golden Russet' and might
make a fine cider variety.

Steve H. Lone Rock, WI USDA zone 3-4

----- Original Message ----- From: "tanis cuff" <tanistanis@hotmail.com>
To: <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] photograph of the rootstock apple Bud-118
heavywithfruit.


So, a sweet apple w/ tannins but not much tart is desireable for
cider-apple
growers?


----Original Message Follows----
From: "loneroc" <>
To: "North American Fruit Explorers" <>
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] photograph of the rootstock apple Bud-118 heavy
withfruit.
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 05:33:43 -0600

Hi Charlie,

Bud 118 has lovely pink flowers and a columnar habit (until the weight of
the fruit drags the branches down). Bud 118 has sweet fruit with a
relatively low acid levels and a nice dose of soft tannins--something that
hard cider makers value for imparting depth (mouthfeel) to the cider. It's
nothing you'd want to eat for dessert. Most European cider apples
(generally so tannic as to be inedible) are not reliably hardy in zones
3-4,
so the usual source of tannin for Northerners has been crabs of various
sorts. These also tend to be very high in acid and have not allowed cider
makers to control levels of acid and tannin independently....

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