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nafex - Re: [NAFEX] Choke Cherries, cyanide, etc.

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  • From: list@ginda.us
  • To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>, Bill Russell <shaman@pennswoods.net>
  • Cc:
  • Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Choke Cherries, cyanide, etc.
  • Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:06:31 -0500


Right. If you eat a lot at once, it will kill you. But if you eat a little at a time, and are otherwise healthy and well fed, you can metabolize it. (Like alcohol, I suppose, but more toxic.) I think I once read an article about how cyanide can be a cumulative toxin in people who are protein-deprived, but that's probably not a problem for most NAFEXers.

Lots of other animals and beasties can metabolize small quantities, too - I wonder if fermentation reduces the cyanide levels? I know that cooking in an open container does.

Ginda

On Feb 26, 2004, at 1:11 PM, Bill Russell wrote:

Right. Cyanide is not a cumulative toxin.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lucky Pittman" <lucky.pittman@murraystate.edu>
To: "longdistshtr" <longdistshtr@shtc.net>; "North American Fruit Explorers"
<nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 6:36 AM
Subject: [NAFEX] Choke Cherries, cyanide, etc.


At 10:25 PM 2/25/2004 -0500, Doc L wrote:
They are pest trees here, kinda like Sweet Gums which Lucky Pittman
abhors.
Indeed, I do. Would much prefer hawthorns, which I could use as
rootstocks
for pears & quinces.

I'm neither a chemist nor a toxicologist, but deal with the cyanide issue
in livestock on a regular basis. Cherry leaves are most toxic in the
wilted state - I've seen cows eat them fresh and green off the tree, and
they'll vaccuum up the yellow senescent leaves that drop off from time to
time throughout the season - with no ill effects. It may be that the
fresh
green leaves are toxic as well as the wilted ones, but that the animals
aren't usually able to access them in the large amounts that precipitate
death like when people inadvisedly pitch big piles of prunings over the
fence to them or a storm comes through and blows trees over or splits big
limbs off - at which time the cows/goats/sheep mob around 'em and race to
see who can eat the most leaves. Japanese yew prunings do a very
efficient
job of killing cattle, as well, due to their high cyanogenic potential.

Prunus spp. leaves contain cyanogenic glucosides and enzymes which alter
those glucosides, but in normal, undamaged leaves, they're contained in
separate cells. When the leaves are damaged - freezing, wilting, chewing,
etc, this allows the chemical reaction to take place between the enzymes
and the cyanogenic glucosides, liberating cyanide, which can then be taken
up into the bloodstream, where it binds to hemoglobin in the erythrocytes,
interfering with its capability to carry oxygen.

On the subject of cyanide in the seeds or a cherry leaf in my jam or wine,
personally, I wouldn't have too much concern about it - wouldn't even be
concerned with crushing seeds in the process of making jelly or
wine. HCN(hydrogen cyanide) is volatile, and any that might be liberated
would probably dissipate harmlessly into the atmosphere during the course
of canning, fermentation, or storage, for that matter.
I wouldn't want to sit down and eat a big bowl of cracked chokecherry
pits,
though.

For more info on prussic acid poisoning, have a look at the following
extension bulletin:
http://ianrpubs.unl.edu/range/g775.htm#what



Lucky Pittman
USDA Zone 6
Hopkinsville, KY

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