North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

["Christopher Mauchline" <mauch1@aol.com>]

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If the canes turn a purplish red over the winter, I'd say it sounds 
like black raspberry.  I know that here in SE PA, with possibly the 
exception of wineberry (a Japanese import that this is definitely 
not) black raspberry is the most abundant wild growing berry.  

My reasoning:
-Not sure about the thorniness issue though I'd say black raspberry 
is inbetween "wide flared" and "little prickly" 
-Caplike fruit going from green to red to black
-Arching canes (do the root where they touch the ground?  A typical 
pattern of black raspberry, but I've also seen that in trailing 
blackberries as well)
-Hard, numerous seeds

Reasons against
-The fruiting doesn't seem typical of black raspberries as they 
usually have a fairly short season.

Chris Mauchline
SE PA, zone 6

--- In nafex@egroups.com, edforest55@h... wrote:
> Can anyone help this fella, he wants to identify a plant he has. 
The 
> fruit seems to have characteristics of both:
> 
> Blackberry or Raspberry? 
> 
> There are wild plants growing in my garden, and I'm not sure if 
they 
> are blackberries or black raspberries.  From the information that I 
> gathered, blackberries have wide, sturdy, and flared thorns on the 
> canes, while raspberries have little prickly thorns all over the 
> canes.  The thorns on my canes are wide, sturdy, and flared. 
> 
> However, I was also told that raspberries have cap-like fruit, and 
> when picked, the stems stay on the plant, while with blackberries, 
> the stems often come off during the harvest.  My berries are not 
very 
> cap-like, but their stems do stay on the plant, and the top part of 
> the fruit is hollow. 
> 
> Now for more of a description of the plants themselves; the deep 
> green leaves grow in sets of five, with 4 leaves coming almost 
> directly off the red cane (thus having very little stems).  These 
> leaves grow at a 45 degree angle to the direction of the stem, 
> pointing in 4 opposite directions.  The fifth leaf has a more 
> pronounced stem, so it sticks out from the cane, and grows parallel 
> to the cane. It is also usually the largest leaf in the cluster. 
> They grow to be about 5 or 6 feet long, arching over themselves 
after 
> reaching about 3 feet. 
> 
> It is September 21, and the plants are still fruiting in 
Northeastern 
> PA (zone 5), although nowhere near as heavily as they were two 
months 
> ago.  The flowers are white, with yellow centers, in late May, 
June, 
> July, and even some in early August (bees love them).  Then berries 
> are green, which matures into red, which darkens until they are a 
> deep shiny black.  There are still red berries on the canes now.  
> Ripe and especially over-ripe berries leave a purple stain on 
> anything they touch.  The seeds are very numerous, and are also 
> hard.  The berries normally are 3/4 of an inch to an inch in 
length, 
> and are about 3/4 of an inch thick at the thickest part, which is 
> just slightly below the stem end of the berry. 
> 
> Any help in identifting this plants would be greatly appreciated.