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  • From: "John D'hondt" <dhondt@eircom.net>
  • To: "Healthy soil and sustainable growing" <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Population
  • Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2011 19:32:16 -0000

I tried to pass on an article that appeared in truthout yesterday but since I have not seen it appear it probably disappeared into cyberspace.
It was an article about population growth and collapse of civilisations that have happened in the past, the reasons why and the consequences for the environment. The article explained we are on the brink of another collapse only this time the situation is slightly different in that this time we will probably take the whole planet down with us.
 
Officially we are already using the resources of more than 3 planets Earth and that is while more than a billion people out of the 7 billion are constantly starving. I read somewhere that even in the US at the moment more than a hundred people per day die from starvation.
 
Also I have not seen any proof that education is helping at all. I am afraid it has more likely something to do with pesticides, hormones and other pollutants in our food, drinking water and everything else we touch and the cost of living. Teachers just like virtually all the rest of the general population are living in denial and never talk about taboo subjects like over-population. What is taught in schools is to fit in the system, go for a career and make lots of money and that may slow down population growth somewhat through stimulating human greed. This is however hardly compatible with organic farming or gardening which are depicted as "looser" activities.
I am afraid that we are an extremely small and continuously shrinking minority in a growing population that is still capable of growing our own food organically or otherwise.
 
John
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 5:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Population

Certainly education is part of the problem, but there are two issues I think are forgotten.

 First is carrying capacity, the united states has non zero population growth last time I checked and estimates I've read suggest it may be 2 or 3 times its carrying capacity already. Although its important to remember these estimates are probably largely based on the status quo of current lifestyles.

 Second countries which have tried education, incentives, and legal restrictions like india and china still have non zero population growth India was like 1.8 percent last time I checked, and I can't remember china's. Certainly education reduces growth, but it doesn't seem to eliminate it.

 It might be possible for there to be enough food to be produced with sustainable farming, or maybe not, but food is not the only resource were going to have to consider. I don't think its logically possible for any sort of farming to feed an immeasurably high population of any one species though. What's lacking in most every country is a serious desire to figure out what a stable reasonable population consists of it simply doesn't fit the emotional needs of individuals or the social and political goals of most governments to invest in figuring what carrying capacities are.



--- On Sun, 3/6/11, Ken Hargesheimer <minifarms2@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Ken Hargesheimer <minifarms2@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Livingontheland] Population
To: "Healthy soil and sustainable growing" <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Sunday, March 6, 2011, 12:45 PM

The one way to stop "over population" is education.  In every country I have lived or worked in, the higher the educational level, the less children couples have.

I learned in Nigeria that children are "insurance for parents old age".  20% die before age 5. Other children die due to whatever.  A large number of children provides a number of children to provide for the parents in old age.  

Organic, no-till farming will support the population of the earth regardless of how high it goes.

Ken Hargesheimer


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