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[David Minton <dminton AT mindspring.com>]

I was very unhappy with question 4.


http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/05/debate.transcript/index.html#q4

Question 4 -- What did Kerry say about "global test"?

IFILL: New question to you, Senator Edwards, but I don't want to let go of
the global test question first, because ... I want people to understand
exactly what it is, as you said, that Senator Kerry did say.

IFILL: He said, "You've got to do" -- you know, he was asked about
preemptive action at the last debate -- he said, "You've got to do it in a
way that passes the test, that passes the global test where your countrymen,
your people understand fully why you're doing what you're doing and can
prove to the world that you did it for legitimate reasons." What is a global
test if it's not a global veto?



We all know what Kerry actually said (no matter what your political
persuasion):

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/01/debate.transcript.13/index.html

KERRY: The president always has the right, and always has had the right, for
pre-emptive strike. That was a great doctrine throughout the Cold War. And
it was always one of the things we argued about with respect to arms
control.

No president, though all of American history, has ever ceded, and nor would
I, the right to pre-empt in any way necessary to protect the United States
of America.

But if and when you do it, Jim, you have to do it in a way that passes the
test, that passes the global test where your countrymen, your people
understand fully why you're doing what you're doing and you can prove to the
world that you did it for legitimate reasons.


It is pretty obvious from the part that moderator left out, that Kerry would
not cede the right to pre-emptive action.

The key to the global test quote that everyone seems to miss is that he said
"prove to the world that you did it for legitimate reasons." Notice the past
tense--he is saying you must prove to the world, after the fact, that you
had legitimate reasons, not ask for approval before hand.

David

On 10/6/04 10:16 AM, "Evan Zimmerman" <evan.zimmerman AT gmail.com> wrote:

> He did lay out some whoppers, especially the whole 'I never said
> Saddam was a part of 9/11' thing.  But not everyone watching will see
> through the redirects and the fog of figures and foreign policy errata
> that he threw in with every answer.
> 
> I was really referring to the fact that he often answered different
> questions than those asked, or didn't answer/follow up at all. I would
> have thought they'd take every opportunity for Cheney to lord his
> considerable "gravitas" over Edwards, but Edwards got out pretty
> unscathed, though he definitely got hard hit a few times.
> 
> A tie is a win for Kerry/Edwards I'd say, since it likely won't slow
> the momentum they have right now. We'll see what the spin does though.
> 
> 
> On Wed, 6 Oct 2004 10:04:09 -0400, Ian Meyer <ianmeyer AT gmail.com> wrote:
>> treading water?
>> 
>> it seemed to me ke was shoving edwards face in a steaming pile of
>> excrement every chance he got, on everything from his voting record
>> (which is indefensibly weak) to his "incorrect facts"
>> 
>> even if it wasn't a correct steaming pile, he was still getting shoved into
>> it
>> 
>> i called it as a draw, between edwards keeping calm and answering
>> questions and cheney blasting him, i think it came out even
>> 
>> ~ian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004 23:27:33 -0400, Evan Zimmerman
>> <evan.zimmerman AT gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Alright, that's over. Looks like if the test is answering the
>>> questions that are asked, Edwards won. He also seemed to keep his
>>> pleasant demeanor, which after last week is obviously pretty important
>>> given the backlash over Bush.
>>> 
>>> I was pretty surprised though -- I expected Cheney to "do" more, but
>>> he really seemed to tread water as much as anything, letting
>>> opportunities to speak go by.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004 21:55:48 -0400, H. Wade Minter <minter AT lunenburg.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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>>>> 
>>>> On Oct 5, 2004, at 9:52 PM, Lance A. Brown wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I'm watching the VP debate live and have CNN on the screen with FoxNews
>>>>> in the PictureInPicture box. FoxNews is almost exactly 4 seconds behind
>>>>> CNN. Wonder if they are delaying on purpose or if its just how it is...
>>>> 
>>>> They're worried that Cheney will drop another F-bomb and the FCC will
>>>> fine them.
>>>> 
>>>> - --Wade
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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>>>> iD8DBQFBY1Cko4DwsyRGDscRAv7UAKC0pPOMnyD2TbTJQW1R2DVqfNGtvQCeNBeA
>>>> 3jY/5m4znm2OLbsRYB8GD6Y=
>>>> =JaPp
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>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ---
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> Evan
>>> 
>>> _________________________
>>> evan.zimmerman AT gmail.com
>>> http://evanz.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ---
>> 
>> 
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>> 
>