Homestead mailing list

[Tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT infionline.net>]

clanSkeen wrote:

>  
>
> > tvoivozhd---well, not really.  You do not know what they will do to you
> > because it is a unilateral contract---something that should be outlawed
> > in any responsible society.
> >    
>
> Or looking at it another way, something no prudent person would enter into.
>  

tvoivozhd---one explanation which fits you and me, but a better 
explanation which fits the hoi polloi without a legal or business 
background (the vast majority), is prudence has little to do with 
it---in the real world that rarity the "fully infomed consumer" has to 
be fully informed of what constitutes a unilateral contract and its 
consequences to make even a quasi-intelligent decision.  Hell, if we are 
to credit reports on K-12 education, most of the population can't read, 
can't write, much less comprehend the difference between a unilateral 
and a bilateral contract.  They have not and never will sit in a class 
on contract law where they might learn the distinction. 

Usury Laws used to protect these people, and worked just fine.  The 
Banking Industry and their Lobbyists handing out bribes to politicians 
stripped away this common sense protection.

Homestead Exemption laws have in the past protected these dumb consumers 
from losing their homes---in my opinion a damned good thing, I would a 
hell of a lot rather see stupid or predatory lenders lose a few bucks 
than families put on the streets, in overccrowded Salvation Army 
shelters, or on welfare rolls.

In Wisconsin when I first went into business, uniliateral contracts were 
unenforceable as against Public Policy---like the Yellow Dog labor 
contracts, contracts with minors et. al.  Bankruptcy Laws had similar 
exemptions---passed and court-enforced as a means of permitting debtors 
to retain sufficient assets to enable them to climb out of what 
otherwise would be an economic grave and resume their place as a 
productive cog in the GDP wheel.

All of the above are under severe and continual assault, one by one 
vanishing from sight, marked off the list for extinction by the Banking 
Industry plus the Presidents and Congressmen they rent.  Senator 
Grassley perennially introduces legislation to strip jobless and ill 
bankrupts of any means of recovery (except his factory farm constituents 
with three to five million dollar exemptions).  With the flood of 
unemployed bankrupts from manufacturing states, he has been afraid of 
re-introducing his punitive legislation this year---it is a temporary 
respite, he never gives up any more than Bush does in their service to 
the Banking Industry.

> 2)  Knowing that this is the nature of the beast, don't enter into any
> agreements with them.  We have a couple of actual local banks here, I know
> everyone hasn't.  I don't use credit but shady deals would get around and
> ruin the bank so by all accounts they don't engage in them.
>  

tvoivozhd---shady deals will ruin a small bank, but grossly increase the 
profits of big banks due to Bush prohibiting any State control of those 
shady deals---and of course the corollary, a BushBribe of $25,000, 000 
this year alone guarantees no Federal remedial legislation.

>  
>
>
>
> I'll stand corrected on this if needs be, Tvo, but my understanding is that
> the current situation is like this:  States can set regulations making
> certain types of contracts illegal even if both parties enter into them with
> full knowledge and consent.  For example, a loan contract with a minor
> cannot be enforced.  In most states if an employer gets you to sign an
> agreement that you will not testify against them in court, it is not binding
> and cannot be enforced.  
>  

tvoivozhd---Yes, for a hundred years States have regulated contracts, 
subject to a couple of limitations, the Full Faith And Credit obligation 
to recognize each others contracts in State Courts and the Federal 
Uniform Commercial Code  There are some exemptions to the former, none 
for the latter.  And up until a few months ago no one except a wildly 
corrupt current President would have dreamt of  interfering with  States 
right to regulate or prohibit abusive credit card contracts.
Not now---Bush has issued regulations specifically prohibiting States from


> Giving the states the right to quell this is a good idea, and no mistake.
>  

States have and always have had the right to quell this---it has been 
taken away by Bush.

> .
>
>
>  
>
> > The unilateral contract and contract law in general has been
> > under State jurisdiction.  It should remain there and would except for
> > the fact Bush got $25,000,000 in bribes this year from MBNA, Chase
> > Manhattan and the other members of the Credit Card Mafia.
> >
> >    
>
> You know how, Tvo, you are fond of saying that we don't live in the past and
> the tools and situations we have in 2004 are what we have and we must make
> wise use of them (to that effect)??   Credit cards USED TO be a legitimate
> contract.  They aren't any more, they are a blatant scam.  No one in their
> right mind would look over the provisions that they DO state and ever sign
> the thing.
>  

tvoivozhd---we can't live in the past.  The future can be altered 
however---and the unilateral contract abolished as it was in 
mid-1940's.  Can't do that as long as Bush remains in office and I doubt 
that Kerry will do anything about it either.


> Would you not say it is so that if the credit card industry were tightly
> regulated, all the fraud and usury squeezed out of it, that a good portion
> of the people decrying how badly they are ripped off by same would find that
> they couldn't get a credit card at all?
>
> James
>  

tvoivozhd---Hell no, credit cards came into being so banks could 
eliminate their loan officers and place the cost of pre-examined credit 
and the minor cost of the loan transaction on the bank customer instead 
of on the bank payroll..

Like every other business, banks are in business of making 
money---(literally), the only business in the U.S. where they can 
legally sell what they do not own, and have a multiplication factor of 
about five in a transaction which would put any other business owner in 
jail for twenty years.

Credit cards are the best means of making money that banks have ever 
encountered.  They absolutely will never give them up, and will readily, 
if reluctantly accommodate to any and all State regulation designed to 
rein them in.