FreeTDS Development Group

[Brian Bruns <camber AT ais.org>]

Believe it or not, I for one, am genuinely interested in where
our documentation falls short so it can be fixed.

There are three main pieces:

1) the INSTALL file with the distribution

It basically says configure, gmake, gmake install and provides some info
on what the configure switches are for.

2) The FAQ http://www.freetds.org/faq.html

It contains some common build problems, how to check out of CVS, and other
FAQs.

3) The FreeTDS Users Guide http://www.freetds.org/userguide/book1.htm

This is a more ambitious document, explaining how to install, how to
configure, and how to get several popular packages (SQSH, Perl, PHP,
iODBC) to work with FreeTDS, along with a trouble shooting section,
historical information, and how to ask for help on the list if all that
fails.

So, specifically where was the documentation lacking...were there
insufficient pointers to the docs? What were you looking for that you
couldn't find among these three?

Looking back on your posts, a couple things come to mind, you never (that
I could see) mentioned what platform you're using beyond saying you
attempted to set --host=ppc, so either Mac OS X, Linux PPC, or AIX i'm
guessing.  There was also no mention of what platform the server is on.

The other big thing, as recommended in the troubleshooting section, is to
set the TDSDUMP env variable and look at the logs.  That will often turn
up information vital in solving the problem.

Again, I'm more than happy to fix the documentation if it is deficient in
some way, but I know FreeTDS inside and out, so it's hard for me to
objectively look at what's missing.  That's where folks like you are
supposed to come in.

I've been working on FreeTDS for around 4 years now.  It's a nights and
weekends project, I don't get paid anything for doing it.  I also enjoy
talking to people on the list and trying to help those that can't seem to
get it to work. But, again, it's something I do in my spare time, and
right now I'm working a whole lot in my day job since they thought it was
a good idea to cut a bunch of people this spring, and working a whole lot
for a paying client of my side business.  Top that all off with a family,
and I don't have a whole lot of time these days for this stuff. So, I'm
not going to feel guilty because someone can't get it working and that is
somehow my fault for not having enough documentation, or not enough time
to respond on the list, or because there are major bugs in 0.52 and I just
don't have time to wrap up 0.53.

Somedays, I'm really sick of this whole damn project, and this is one of
them.

Brian

On Wed, 17 Oct 2001, Norman Palardy wrote:

> I know I won't win any friends with this; but that's not my point.
> Obviously I'm not the only person who is having trouble with getting 
> FreeTDS up and running.
> 
> <RANT>
> Where is "configure, make, make install, test" insufficient ?
> 
> configure has how many options ?
> To someone who simply wants to USE FreeTDS it is a large array of 
> options many of which are not 100% clear which should be used together 
> etc.
> I've even asked people on this list directly what options they used for 
> their install, which should be the same as mine (same version of the OS 
> on mostly the same hardware .. certainly the same processors) I've done 
> the exact same steps they did, no luck. So either they did other steps, 
> options, etc. or I've used a version of the source that is not what they 
> used. I started with what's available from freetds.org on the download 
> page.
> 
> I've seen people mention that the sources from the CVS repository should 
> be used.
> That's fine, and I would, if I had some idea where this was or how to 
> get them out of CVS.
> 
> make?
> Even after configuring things I try and compile any of the unittests doe 
> the dblib portion and they don't make. Some libs simply don't exist that 
> these are being linked against
> 
> make install
> Usually I end up having to su to root before this has any hope of 
> working and that is not mentioned in any of the install guides that I 
> have seen or read that are part of the distribution at 
> http://www.freetds.org/download.html
> 
> test ?
> I'm told the BEST test is to try and compile sqsh which is another 
> adventure since it requires much of the same as FreeTDS.
> And if it doesn't compile it's still possible that I have a good FreeTDS 
> install with a bad install/make of SQSH for some reason like SQSH's 
> configure not knowing anything about the host I have
> 
> Documentation ? The download includes documentation. Right
> It includes a README that doesn't say enough about building the install 
> to make it useful.
> The doc files are in SGML. And no mention of what I might use to read it 
> or what might be useful.
> 
> I'd LOVE to use FreeTDS. But at this point I can't get "configure, make, 
> make install, test" to work for me
> 
> I've even said on this list I'd pay for it if I could just GET a binary 
> that would install and work. I haven't seen one offered up yet.
> AND THE OFFER STILL STANDS.
> 
> For me and the organizations I contract at this sort of thing is 
> precisely why they refuse to use any freeware for ANY systems in the 
> company.
> No linux, no gcc, nothing. It's too large an effort to try and rely on 
> freeware without any assurances that it really will work, and they don't 
> pay me to make these things work; they pay me to build and improve the 
> systems that use these sorts of components. So we use Sybase, Oracle, 
> Solaris, etc. Things that already ship with official support from these 
> vendors. And they pay the huge license fees and annual support contracts 
> because they can feel confident that if/when something goes wrong or 
> can't make work they have a vendor whom they can pressure to get people 
> on site and fix it.
> 
> I've been the one trying to suggest that the project I'm currently on 
> with them might be suitable to use FreeTDS and a few other items.
> 
> But I'm not going to win any converts if getting FreeTDS set up on the 
> platforms we're looking at is any indication of future success.
> </RANT>
> 
> On Wednesday, October 17, 2001, at 07:44  PM, James Cameron wrote:
> 
> > James Cameron <cameron AT stl.dec.com>
> 
> 
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