Biblical Hebrew Forum

[K Randolph <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>]

Nir:

On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 1:44 PM, Nir cohen - Prof. Mat. 
<nir AT ccet.ufrn.br>wrote:

>  karl,
>
> i admit that "expand" and "hit repeatedly" are related ideas and it is
> easy to see which "came first". but the etymology used in most of these
> citations is more directly related to "hit repeatedly".
>

The word in Biblical Hebrew for “hit repeatedly” is כתת KTT. Used of metal
smithing where hitting repeatedly is part of the job.

>
> in 2 sam 22:43 the idea is that of repeated beating/hammering/smiting and
> not of expanding:
>
> (NIV) They cried for help, but there was no one to save them—
>     to the Lord, but he did not answer.
> 43 I beat them as fine as the dust of the earth;
>     I pounded and trampled them like mud in the streets.They cried for
> help, but there was no one to save them—
>     to the Lord, but he did not answer.
> 43 I beat them as fine as the dust of the earth;
>     I pounded and trampled them like mud in the streets.
>

v.43, “I make them a mist as the dust of the earth (a cloud of dust), as
the mud outside I grind them fine, I spread them out.” Where is the
repeated hitting in the use of “spread out”?

>
> in job 37:18 LEHARQY( is the verb associated with RAQI(, as e.g. in
> english combinations such as sky-rocketing or sky-scraper. thus, i see this
> is a secondary use of the word, i.e. once RAQY( was fixed as "sky" then
> LEHARQY( means to take off/fly/spacewalk/launch. again, i do not see that
> as indicating expansion.
>
> in particular, with all the difficulties associated with the word $XQ, the
> expression in job TARQI( LA$XAQYM can hardly be translated as "expand to
> the skies". the way i see it, it simply means "travel with him to the sky
> so as to tell how he does these things".
>

I wonder what etymology you are talking about. “You cause his people to
spread out to the mists”

>
> the remaining of the citations agrees with craftsmanship and hammering,
> including "ROQE( H))RC in the first few citations you mentioned.
>

Only if you start out with the presupposiiton that it is connected with
hammering.

>
> see also the related term RDD.
>

RDD too is connected with the idea of spreading out, such as clothing.
Nothing with pounding.

>
> nir cohen
>
> This could be a place where we need to agree to disagree, as I don’t see
what you’re seeing at all. I see no evidence in etymology that supports the
idea of hammering as being the basic idea.

Karl W. Randolph.