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  • From: "B. M. Rocine" <brocine AT twcny.rr.com>
  • To: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] We and us
  • Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:22:47 -0500

B-Haverim,

Peter makes a good point. In addition, we may take note of third person being substituted for second in BH (and English?), as in 'adoni hammelek substituting for 'attah.

Shalom,
Bryan

Peter Kirk wrote:


Later, David wrote:
... Helmbrecht demonstrates that the grammaticalisation of politeness distinctions in the first-person is from a number of options: nouns denoting "servant" and "slave" etc (Japanese, Thai, Burmese, Vietnamese, Turkish); ...

If the use of nouns denoting "servant" and "slave" for the first person counts here, then certain registers of English must be considered an exception to Helmbrecht's rule and so potentially similar to Hebrew. For in English there is no politeness distinction in second person pronouns, but in some registers "your humble servant" is used consistently as a politeness related substitute for "I". And in fact precisely the same happens in the Turkic language into which I am working on Bible translation; in the register the translators have chosen to use, second person polite forms are not used (as not appropriate in a historical context, for they are known to be a recent innovation), but a form "your slave" similar to the now obsolete Turkish usage is sometimes used in this translation, especially where the Hebrew offers some support. But then that implies that Hebrew is an exception to Helmbrecht's rule for sometimes using `ABDEKA as a first person form, quite apart from 'ANI and 'ANOKI.


--
B. M. Rocine
Living Word Church
6101 Court St. Rd.
Syracuse, NY 13026
(W): 315.437.6744




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