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  • From: Yigal Levin <leviny1 AT mail.biu.ac.il>
  • To: b-hebrew <b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Isaiah 14:4
  • Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 22:28:39 +0200

Hi Karl.

I didn't intend to go off list. I guess I just clicked "reply" without changing the address.

In any case, the first part of the verse is certainly NOT Aramaic: as for the second part, it's not either, although I think that the individual words could be, the syntax is not.

Yigal


----- Original Message ----- From: "Karl Randolph" <kwrandolph AT email.com>
To: "Yigal Levin" <leviny1 AT mail.biu.ac.il>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 4:22 PM
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Isaiah 14:4


Yigal:

I see you took this off list.

That's not the question.

The question is, are these words also simple Aramaic? And if so, do they have the same meanings as simple Hebrew? If the answer is "yes" to both the above, then is it possible that Isaiah intended a simple Aramaic inclusion in his text, just as Jeremiah did?

Yes I recognize that the man on the street did not know Aramaic, and I suspect that there was little change from Isaiah's day to Jeremiah's. That's why Jeremiah had only one sentence in Aramaic in his whole book. Is it possible that Isaiah did the same?

Karl W. Randolph.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Yigal Levin" <leviny1 AT mail.biu.ac.il>

Karl,

Unlike Jer. 10:11, which is totally Aramaic, Isaiah 14:4 is in
Hebrew. Besides the last word, there is no other word in the whole
verse which is not simple Hebrew. IF one is to understands
"madhebah" as being derived from Aramaic "dahab", it is either an
Aramaic loan-word in a Hebrew context, or an Aramaism, that is, use
of an Aramaic form to create a "Hebrew" word. I, for one, am not
convinced - "golden" does not really fit the context. I'd
understand "madhebah" as being derived for the Hebrew "YHB/RHB" -
"pride".

Also, assuming that Isaiah 14:4 is original to the historical
Isaiah, he lived at a time when most Judahites (his audience) would
not have understood Aramaic (cf. Rab-shakeh). Jeremiah, a century
later, lived at a time in which Aramaic had become the common
language of the region, and any educated Judahite probably would
understand a phrase or two.

Yigal

>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Karl Randolph" <kwrandolph AT email.com>
>>
>> > Dear B-Hebrew haburim:
>> >
>> > While reading through Isaiah 14, I question if the
>> > last five words in verse 4 are Aramaic? Do they
>> > make sense as Aramaic?
>> >
>> > The dictionaries I consulted carry only those
>> > Aramaic terms that are found in the recognized
>> > Aramaic sections of Tanakh. Four of the terms are
>> > not found in those sections. The last term is
>> > happax legomenon in Hebrew where neither the
>> > context nor a possible root are a clear help to
>> > decipher a possible meaning. However in Aramaic it
>> > looks as if it means "gilded".
>> >
>> > )YK same as Hebrew?
>> > $BT to take captive, to stop?
>> > NG# a harsh one? harsh actions?
>> > $BTH same as $BT above?
>> > MDHBH gilded one?
>> >
>> > Any thoughts?
>> >
>> > Karl W. Randolph.

--
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