permaculture

[Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com>]

Yes, a big “thank you” to Darren for posting that. There are so many rumors 
in permaculture history! While we’ve still got the pioneer generation around, 
let’s get these stories down direct from them so that the spoilers can’t do 
their typical revisionist number on them.

Andrew Jeeves joined in on a thread on the Regrarians FB page a few months 
ago and wrote a lucid and hysterically funny bit on the process of writing 
the Designer’s Manual. I don’t feel right about quoting the whole thing (I 
saved it but don’t see it on FB any more), but here’s one piece of it:

> 
> Bill sat at his desk mulling and musing and reading and cursing and 
> drinking cups of tea and looked after his ailing mother and wrote on scraps 
> of paper an idea or two and threw these in a big old wooden tea chest. When 
> he saw an interesting article, he ripped it out of the magazine and threw 
> it into the tea chest. At times he went out to "The Swamp", our wonderful 
> property across the road, and planted trees, or directed our drott driver 
> to build dams and swales and drains and islands. At times we went fishing 
> and hauled the net on Godfrey's beach, he on the shore end and me on the 
> deep end and then we had a big feed on poddy mullet or salmon. Eventually 
> the tea chest was full. So, we all got together (Bill, Reny [Slay], me, 
> Simon Fell and sometimes visitors) and started putting the upended tea 
> chest into themes. We ended up with a dozen or so. Bill then started 
> writing to the themes using the ideas and info collected and drawing it all 
> together, linking, theorising, all in his chicken scratch writing.

It’s this sort of stuff we need to chisel into some stone blocks. And it 
makes me want to hang out with Andrew.
>  
It also reminds me of these wise words from a great American:

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they 
are genuine" -- Abraham Lincoln

Toby
http://patternliteracy.com

Just out: my new book on urban permaculture, The Permaculture City. Order it 
at your favorite bookseller or 
http://www.chelseagreen.com/bookstore/item/the_permaculture_city/



> On Jul 31, 2015, at 7:32 PM, Bob Waldrop <bob@bobwaldrop.net> wrote:
> 
> Another valuable historical testimony.  I have started a file to save this 
> kind of thing that seems to pop up occasionally for the sake of posterity.  
> The internet is a great resource, but it is very fragile.  While we can 
> read clay tablets from ancient Babylon, I have a box of floppy diskettes 
> from the 1990s that are useless to me.  Somewhere there might be a machine 
> that can read them, but unlikely.  So I will print this on acid free paper. 
>  I took a historiography class in my early college years and it made me a 
> "hoarder of historical info", lol.  Eventually my small file of printed 
> emails will find itself into a permanent permaculture archive at a 
> university somewhere.  Does anyone know of such a place?
> 
> Bob Waldrop, Okie City
> 
> On 7/31/2015 7:03 PM, HeenanDoherty wrote:
>> G’day,
>> 
>> I am working pretty closely (like 5 days a week!) with Andrew Jeeves these 
>> days — as you’ve noted Lawrence, he is my partner in producing the 
>> ‘Regrarians Handbook’ (2. Geography chapter just released this week — 
>> http://www.regrarians.org/product/regrarians-ehandbook-2-geography/ 
>> <http://www.regrarians.org/product/regrarians-ehandbook-2-geography/>).
>> 
>> On the Regrarians Facebook group 
>> (https://www.facebook.com/groups/Regrarians 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/groups/Regrarians>), following the very strong 
>> suggestion of Geoff Lawton’s daughter, Bonnie Lawton Freibergs, that 
>> Andrew’s involvement in the production of the PDM was relatively minor, we 
>> had the following exchange:
>> 
>>  Bonnie Lawton Freibergs 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/bonnie.lawtonfreibergs?fref=ufi> "Yes Drew, 
>> Andrew, over 2 beyond full-time years, did the designs & illustrations, 
>> layout and editing and worked with with Reny and Francis Mollison in 
>> pulling the project together with Bill Mollison himself." - Sorry that's 
>> not true Darren J. Doherty 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/DarrenJDoherty?hc_location=ufi>. Andrew did some 
>> of the illustrations yes, but not everything. He did not do the cover, for 
>> example, and he was paid very well for the work he did do (two years with 
>> full time rate of pay) and that information comes directly from Bill and 
>> Lisa OR you could just flip the book open and check the publishing 
>> information = COVER ARTWORK: CAROLYN WATSON-PAUL. It's a real shame you 
>> feel the need to put down the man that started a movement you now depend 
>> on. Bill is a fantastic person who deserves nothing but your respect. I 
>> can't speak for Bill and Lisa but if you are trading off their name/book 
>> and using false statements as an endorsement of your product, I'm not a 
>> solicitor, but you could very well find yourself in an actionable position.
>> 
>> Darren J. Doherty <https://www.facebook.com/DarrenJDoherty?fref=ufi> 
>> Thanks Bonnie 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/bonnie.lawtonfreibergs?hc_location=ufi>, very 
>> interesting indeed and I'll let Andrew Jeeves 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves.3?hc_location=ufi> speak for 
>> himself on the matter's that are around his involvement in the development 
>> of the PDM.
>> 
>> Otherwise my signed copy of the PDM contains a different reference 
>> toAndrew Jeeves 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves.3?hc_location=ufi>'s work than 
>> yours does.
>> 
>> #Revisionism <https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/revisionism?hc_location=ufi>
>> 
>> Andrew Jeeves <https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves.3?fref=ufi> Hello 
>> all. Whilst not wishing to get into a slanging match... the cover Bonnie 
>> talks about has been re-done with the same illustration (my work) and the 
>> title rearranged. The credit to C. W-P. is probably for the rearrangement 
>> of the cover. Whilst putting together the book over a number of years, 
>> none of us were paid - we all worked on a shoestring to try and get the 
>> book done. We worked full time and it was either go out and get money or 
>> do the book. We had to juggle all that. You can quote whoever you like but 
>> the arrangement we had and I accepted, was to be paid after the book was 
>> printed with a number of books to be sold/distributed as I wished. I have 
>> no bad feelings about any of that and we did what we did. The three of us 
>> had come from living in Tasmania as part of an intentional community where 
>> money was tight and we were used to working in such circumstances. It is 
>> clear that the cover attribution has changed based on a rearrangement of 
>> the cover in a subsequent edition (the original plates may not have been 
>> able to be used). But I did the whole book except for a few lovely 
>> illustrations by Jorge Schultz.
>> 
>> And then a reply from Bill’s grandson (Frances Mollison’s son):
>> 
>> Stuart Muir Wilson <https://www.facebook.com/stuart.m.wilson.7?fref=ufi> 
>> What is done is done, my mum and dad help publish the first edition of the 
>> designers manual,while Grandpa (Bill) traveled to India for his first 
>> International PDC withRobyn Francis 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/robyn.francis1?hc_location=ufi>. Mum and Dad are 
>> happy not being acknowledge or paid and have long let it go. Though their 
>> contribution is nothing along side Andrews. I was only a baby at the time 
>> and I really enjoy and support Darren 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/DarrenJDoherty?hc_location=ufi> and Andrew 
>> <https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves.3?hc_location=ufi>work. It was a 
>> very hectic time from what I understand. Being the start of a global 
>> movement. The PDM was a work of genius. I think respecting ones elders has 
>> been one of the better virtues I have been raised with. I look forward to 
>> reading the Regrarians handbook chapter 1.
>> 
>> The PDM has evidently gone on to sell over 400,000 copies (for between 
>> $80-120) and so in retrospect Andrew (and Frances) would have been wise to 
>> have negotiated a better deal at the time — alas they didn’t and that’s 
>> the way things go some time.
>> 
>> For the record Andrew and I are 50:50 on the royalties of The Regrarians 
>> Handbook — time will tell if it reaches the sales figures of the PDM — but 
>> whatever the case I believe in respecting and honouring the work of my 
>> collaborators appropriately and from the outset.
>> 
>> Thanks and all the best,
>> 
>> Yours & Growing,
>> 
>> Lisa Heenan, Isaebella Doherty & Darren J. Doherty,
>> Directors,
>> 
>> Regrarians Ltd.
>> 
>> CHECK OUT REGRARIANS.ORG <http://regrarians.org/>!!
>> 
>> like us on facebook <http://bit.ly/RegrariansFB>
>> join our facebook group <http://bit.ly/RegrariansFBGroup>
>> follow us on twitter <http://www.twitter.com/regrarians>
>> 
>> +61 (0) 400.840.845
>> +61 (0) 431.444.836
>> 
>> ALL YOUR LAND NEEDS
>> #EatBuyGrow • #PlanTrainShow
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 1 Aug 2015, at 03:37, Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Here are links to Andrew Jeeves from a Google search:
>>> 
>>> Andrew Jeeves : Facets.org.au <http://facets.org.au/>
>>> www.facets.org.au/andrew-jeeves/ <http://www.facets.org.au/andrew-jeeves/>
>>> Andrew Jeeves is a skilled sustainability specialist, with more than 30
>>> years' experience on three continents. He is a widely acknowledged trainer
>>> and presenter ...
>>> Andrew Jeeves | Facebook
>>> https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves 
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/andrew.jeeves>
>>> Andrew Jeeves is on Facebook. Join Facebook to connect with Andrew Jeeves
>>> and others you may know. Facebook gives people the power to share and ...
>>> Andrew Jeeves Profiles | Facebook
>>> https://www.facebook.com/public/Andrew-Jeeves 
>>> <https://www.facebook.com/public/Andrew-Jeeves>
>>> Facebook
>>> View the profiles of people named Andrew Jeeves on Facebook. Join Facebook
>>> to connect with Andrew Jeeves and others you may know.
>>> Regrarians Handbook | Regrarians
>>> www.regrarians.org/regrarian-handbook/ 
>>> <http://www.regrarians.org/regrarian-handbook/>
>>> Darren has joined forces with 'Permaculture: A Designers' Manual' (1988)
>>> Designer, Illustrator & Editor Andrew Jeeves in what promises to be the
>>> production of ...
>>> Andrew Jeeves profiles | LinkedIn
>>> https://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Andrew/Jeeves 
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Andrew/Jeeves>
>>> View the profiles of professionals named Andrew Jeeves on LinkedIn. There
>>> are 8 professionals named Andrew Jeeves, who use LinkedIn to exchange ...
>>> PcIntro.htm - Permaculture Activist
>>> www.permacultureactivist.net/intro/PcIntro.htm 
>>> <http://www.permacultureactivist.net/intro/PcIntro.htm>
>>> Artist: Andrew Jeeves). Some History: The word "permaculture" was coined
>>> and popularized in the mid 70's by David Holmgren, a young Australian
>>> ecologist, ...
>>> 
>>> Reverse image search with Google gave the list at this URL of some sites
>>> using Andrew's drawings:
>>> 
>>> https://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZiubdhEp7aRuzUpfr3LB8SVMvcXkLQXf4PvyUogd6OaQdzwOID2LhBRPdg36bdAOH1pLnSSBfFuqNAjEAFRP9oQQr1v7R1fdWTQHpTsMa62EMA7p8EnZb8QRn8VloPcBFeiQUE76aLwtrgr1oYqFyRW1_1kJectCFG6DEVnoy1z5uJceds6fThZ7tmQ-OSwHKIpIaLHb-V-S9U8wfpCZpGNvkxDlliYlFAi_1wjGm4Y5EN4mFTeC6lZacllXrZ8U-CkeXeXHVD8pWLn0kupM8NOhBzeHrr_1RV3BulGguPyFxcAYQwQPFQjwn0SVJdnvw_1sgFt8Ngn7YopWNfWpRPZB6dso6-ULYM0gMrxnS2L9K2Enda2e2yqJyUO9VkognzE5fn_1C_1Yto-NwwcccTALjoSO_1AEfQXNtCc4dH1FZjXfRnZY1CyH5BTWSxtBz0GvTJgWCJV1OPMOM21HoI9gtwzQhBBXqR7GBfz9fQQKY7F0N1bl5wn6d_14I9uqYH5FzXNLYD282QhfxUZvjMUar2LfuIjtfbWuyEnOk4BRQ56qz5v5HvJbjlejx4egcGs6lMmJljqi3LeVJUJaryF9T1WkzyCHlZIvZtsAkMVs4qUliIESULNJmTqS9ssH4QtaYPSJCaz-PsT35iMgxfjfbi3InGR1UWiFFFNft1YlETRnCauZQ8rqYK_1VEP080TXW9-5oLg9X6pu8DsM7EZyzif2Sfe2PpPw6Os6c1lCrveP5OfbqJ9Vza25ANfoicANOvJSdAABgy9TViCFv-m9AyI_1PutBgnIPQlpGhHt_1cg3OBUk-9W7yM5EBkfqNkfEzNuwGDIm82apgdrG5EF3T5nB_1vtgVettNPwfdLkUHwvPmA07Ay3pXsp9tQhoxdOt2RLp1xk1MtdXd9XEGDSTLre36YnlOglqbfw-Ncd5PGx3I0ZrkuAyukjceLP7J7qUTd95gP4oJ1SHvwsq6veALkbHox2xa86cys02x7RfW9riHnxMDdKfnN1N93G3Iy1rqHQdpus3-ltdm84U9b2ewS5sjMRKgqTGvD0K4OVz3xLsgnRX1H6AzHRY9ZWU3Ezu50G1FlmgAs-9Ev009fyCBF8jJJdO8EgjQLEqd9KENORbVcDTydaoNRY_1HJn2avEmL4_1eeXX_17uOlqhYm3uduQ4iJQOaXT2bm8ktb-kOip8r0cj4hIpVDVDxteCOOsulSwacr_1G5C-FehggzbzfAAmVbe2LiCIg_1MTcPvZOkzgIpFGrLT4ZypMFUvNSNb1g2QEpdDPWBXmKnRPiKrculkjKZKsfR4OOiSKR7Fe1Omung_1DLoNGlXOuCvwi8oZO9yE1AQ-vr9pPdgvR9aP6vSE5EZdXTDZ4ZpUpL9jN9nIIcHWnNFjWxwSIOnpHHRhkcQPZWSB0G2uyliC_1n5frmADzSpq8VtUUKurIeatGjmewNFeSoW61GeY8KKEGQmS9bQK5yIYErqT-23IEE2woswvtJfqR0QFM-Jme-rCGr41dxVvAhaGVVXnhAIa0&hl=en&biw=1366&bih=608&site=imghp&sa=X&ved=0CBkQ9Q8oAGoVChMI9fGV6vOFxwIVEhqSCh2SrQ4h
>>>  
>>> <https://www.google.com/search?tbs=sbi:AMhZZiubdhEp7aRuzUpfr3LB8SVMvcXkLQXf4PvyUogd6OaQdzwOID2LhBRPdg36bdAOH1pLnSSBfFuqNAjEAFRP9oQQr1v7R1fdWTQHpTsMa62EMA7p8EnZb8QRn8VloPcBFeiQUE76aLwtrgr1oYqFyRW1_1kJectCFG6DEVnoy1z5uJceds6fThZ7tmQ-OSwHKIpIaLHb-V-S9U8wfpCZpGNvkxDlliYlFAi_1wjGm4Y5EN4mFTeC6lZacllXrZ8U-CkeXeXHVD8pWLn0kupM8NOhBzeHrr_1RV3BulGguPyFxcAYQwQPFQjwn0SVJdnvw_1sgFt8Ngn7YopWNfWpRPZB6dso6-ULYM0gMrxnS2L9K2Enda2e2yqJyUO9VkognzE5fn_1C_1Yto-NwwcccTALjoSO_1AEfQXNtCc4dH1FZjXfRnZY1CyH5BTWSxtBz0GvTJgWCJV1OPMOM21HoI9gtwzQhBBXqR7GBfz9fQQKY7F0N1bl5wn6d_14I9uqYH5FzXNLYD282QhfxUZvjMUar2LfuIjtfbWuyEnOk4BRQ56qz5v5HvJbjlejx4egcGs6lMmJljqi3LeVJUJaryF9T1WkzyCHlZIvZtsAkMVs4qUliIESULNJmTqS9ssH4QtaYPSJCaz-PsT35iMgxfjfbi3InGR1UWiFFFNft1YlETRnCauZQ8rqYK_1VEP080TXW9-5oLg9X6pu8DsM7EZyzif2Sfe2PpPw6Os6c1lCrveP5OfbqJ9Vza25ANfoicANOvJSdAABgy9TViCFv-m9AyI_1PutBgnIPQlpGhHt_1cg3OBUk-9W7yM5EBkfqNkfEzNuwGDIm82apgdrG5EF3T5nB_1vtgVettNPwfdLkUHwvPmA07Ay3pXsp9tQhoxdOt2RLp1xk1MtdXd9XEGDSTLre36YnlOglqbfw-Ncd5PGx3I0ZrkuAyukjceLP7J7qUTd95gP4oJ1SHvwsq6veALkbHox2xa86cys02x7RfW9riHnxMDdKfnN1N93G3Iy1rqHQdpus3-ltdm84U9b2ewS5sjMRKgqTGvD0K4OVz3xLsgnRX1H6AzHRY9ZWU3Ezu50G1FlmgAs-9Ev009fyCBF8jJJdO8EgjQLEqd9KENORbVcDTydaoNRY_1HJn2avEmL4_1eeXX_17uOlqhYm3uduQ4iJQOaXT2bm8ktb-kOip8r0cj4hIpVDVDxteCOOsulSwacr_1G5C-FehggzbzfAAmVbe2LiCIg_1MTcPvZOkzgIpFGrLT4ZypMFUvNSNb1g2QEpdDPWBXmKnRPiKrculkjKZKsfR4OOiSKR7Fe1Omung_1DLoNGlXOuCvwi8oZO9yE1AQ-vr9pPdgvR9aP6vSE5EZdXTDZ4ZpUpL9jN9nIIcHWnNFjWxwSIOnpHHRhkcQPZWSB0G2uyliC_1n5frmADzSpq8VtUUKurIeatGjmewNFeSoW61GeY8KKEGQmS9bQK5yIYErqT-23IEE2woswvtJfqR0QFM-Jme-rCGr41dxVvAhaGVVXnhAIa0&hl=en&biw=1366&bih=608&site=imghp&sa=X&ved=0CBkQ9Q8oAGoVChMI9fGV6vOFxwIVEhqSCh2SrQ4h>
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 11:47 AM, Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:lfljvenaura@gmail.com>>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 11:38 AM, Toby Hemenway 
>>>> <toby@patternliteracy.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I love that every one of those drawings is reproduced in violation of
>>>>> copyright law. If Andrew Jeeves had a penny from everyone who posted a
>>>>> drawing of his illegally, he’d be rich. It is splendid, useful work, for
>>>>> sure.
>>>>> 
>>>> I had a feeling about that when I saw it. The imgur page provided no
>>>> credits to the artist who did the work whatsoever. I looked and didn't 
>>>> find
>>>> any. Maybe a reverse image search could be done to find an author 
>>>> reference
>>>> then post it.
>>>> Thanks for letting us know who actually did this excellent work, Toby.
>>>> LL
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Lawrence F. London
>>>> lfljvenaura@gmail.com
>>>> https://sites.google.com/site/avantgeared/
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Lawrence F. London
>>> lfljvenaura@gmail.com <mailto:lfljvenaura@gmail.com>
>>> https://sites.google.com/site/avantgeared/ 
>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/avantgeared/>
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