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  • From: venaurafarm <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
  • To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: [permaculture] Types of plumbing pipe and tubing used in compost tea brewers, aquaculture, aquaponics, which is safest to use.
  • Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 14:38:22 -0400

-------- Original Message --------
Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 18:16:02 -0000
From: Tim Wilson <thegoodjob@hotmail.com>
To: compost_tea@yahoogroups.com

--- In compost_tea@yahoogroups.com, "Bryce Ruddock" <bruddockjr@...> wrote:

This is an interesting conversation and I have stayed out of it till
now to see how it develops. I spent 32 years of my work career in the
paint industry using many chemicals in a variety of ways so have
managed to pick up a few precautionary practices along the way. Here
is my opinion on PVC. The hard pipe PVC used in construction of water
drainpipe lines both interior and exterior is supposedly okay to use
since the chemical of most concern used in its manufacture is dibutyl
tin oxide which industry tests claim is bound up in the plastic
itself with no degradation over time and no leachate. I would think
that use of the proper schedule of the plastic pipe for exterior use
would ensure that any breakdown would not occur and any contamination
of a water supply be prevented. Of course I still do not trust
industry tests regarding leachates of chemicals and that is from
years of watching the health data get updated from safe to toxic on
MSDS sheets. Sometimes in the media the types of butyl tin oxides
get confused. Tributyl tin oxide for instance is used in the wood
products industry as a fungicide. The stuff is inherently toxic and
is classed as a biocide that is toxic to all life. It is not used as
a stabilizer in the manufacture of PVC pipe. We used TBTI a lot in
paints. PVC is normally a rather brittle plastic so to stabilize it
the DBTI is added to make for a stronger pipe product. DBTI is
however not used in the manufacture of flexible PVC packaging ,
tubing, toys , etc. That would make those flexible applications as
hard a the pipes. The issue with flexible PVC is with the chemical
agents used to soften the plastic, phthalates. Phthalates are toxic
and damage the endocrine system. Many of them are carcinogenic. Many
of them readily leach from the plastic. With such a bad rep it is
safe to assume that phthalates would not be friendly to organisms we
might to culture in a compost tea. I do not recommend flexible PVC
tubing but with so few real alternatives that are priced to fit a
budget we do need to sometimes compromise. A suggestion to those
using PVC flexible tubing is to thoroughly wash the it before first
use in tepid, not hot, water, with a mild non alkaline soap. This way
one could hopefully remove any residual surface contamination of
phthalates without degrading the plastic and releasing more of the
same. When using the tubing for compost tea preparations it would be
best to keep the temperature at the lowest level that will still
enhance biological activity and to keep the pH as neutral as possible
with the intent of reducing leachate from the tubing. If anyone is
thinking of using a polycarbonate tubing- don't. Polycarbonates are
as bad or worse than PVC and has BPA in them. I worked with it nearly
every day in paints. It's nasty in the long run. So PVC tubing is
maybe okay but with caveats as stated above. If anyone has had any
luck with non plastic tubing, perhaps glass, or stainless, it may be
an option available from lab supply houses. Bryce Ruddock

----- Original Message ----- From: jason_z@... To:
compost_tea@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 11:33 AM

I agree with Tim. PVC is certainly not the ideal material in that its
not sustainable, however its cheap, easy to clean, used for potable
water and durable.

Hemp sounds good I'm sure bamboo could be used also?

From my little bit of research it seems the Bioreactor at microbe
organics.com or the 5 gallon KIS brewer would be great choices for a
smaller farmer and the Microbulator for a larger farm.

Natural farming in my opinion is all about sustainability and there's
nothing sustainable about paying 4 or $5,000 for a tea brewer. I
personally built my 5 gallon bucket with PVC air tubing and a eco
plus commercial air pump. I have my eye on creating my own Bioreactor
once I source a tank.

--- In compost_tea@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Wilson" <thegoodjob@>
wrote:

I would love to use some less harmful materials but then the price
would put the brewers out of reach of common folks.

The PVC we do use is marked potable for drinking water and it lasts
for a long time. The time when it is bad for the environment is
when it decomposes or burns.



  • [permaculture] Types of plumbing pipe and tubing used in compost tea brewers, aquaculture, aquaponics, which is safest to use., venaurafarm, 03/27/2013

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