Skip to Content.
Sympa Menu

permaculture - Re: [permaculture] permaculture Digest, Vol 73, Issue 16

permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: permaculture

List archive

Chronological Thread  
  • From: Martin Mikush <martinmikush@gmail.com>
  • To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] permaculture Digest, Vol 73, Issue 16
  • Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 21:20:41 +0200

Hi guys and girsl and bos and s istas

from Bulgaria, I am calling for help with some ideas how to fight the
ignorance of the people in power who are resisting to think for the future
as part of us?
The poor city planning executed on the city tissue of a town , here in
Bulgaria leeds to a bottlenecks of traffic, poor air quality and grimm
prospects for the future ?
I am still resisting to give up my right to grow plants in my yard , here in
the City Of SOFIA >>>
any suggestions for suggestive techniques of persuasion ?
political elite rulez here ...
I MEAN THEY RULE !

what tha fuck ?
Community plannig of any kind is part of the past they say
to have gardens
plant em on your piece of land
wine
grow wine
grow wine- windling plants who will soon rule the cities
of our common future ...
I am sillent till the answer gets out ...
out

MM

On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 8:19 PM,
<permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org>wrote:

> Send permaculture mailing list submissions to
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> permaculture-request@lists.ibiblio.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> permaculture-owner@lists.ibiblio.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of permaculture digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: beautifully moving video (Keith Johnson)
> 2. Re: list topics/ beautifully moving video (Toby Hemenway)
> 3. list topics/ beautifully moving video (Lawrence F. London, Jr.)
> 4. USDA-NRCS Pollination Survey for Agricultural Producers
> (Lawrence F. London, Jr.)
> 5. The GOP's Jihad on Obama (Nicholas Roberts)
> 6. The GOP's Jihad on Obama (Lawrence F. London, Jr.)
> 7. Portland, OR. Permaculture Course with Marisha Auerbach,
> Jordan Fink, Henry Stanley and others. (Jordan Fink)
> 8. pc design courses in India or other eastern countries?
> (Mike McGregor)
> 9. Re: pc design courses in India or other eastern countries?
> (Hannah Roessler)
> 10. pc design courses in India or other eastern countries?
> (Wesley Roe and Santa Barbara Permaculture Network)
> 11. Re: Need top bar beehive design specs (Scott Pittman)
> 12. Re: list topics/ beautifully moving video (Scott Pittman)
> 13. Re: list topics (Keith Johnson)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:46:56 -0500
> From: Keith Johnson <keithdj@mindspring.com>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] beautifully moving video
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <4991E7C0.6020302@mindspring.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Trudie,
> Sorry if I pushed your sense of limitations for this list but given the
> behavior of other posters on the list I'm surprised you hadn't spoken up
> sooner. The general consensus has been to use 'delete'. I happen to know
> for certain that others on the list were grateful to receive it. There
> are many other submissions to the list that annoy me, like those of
> Nicholas Roberts whose submissions are rarely brief, generally numerous
> and often "off-topic", and despite all that I generally appreciate the
> guy himself and his underlying intentions. I personally feel that his
> style is a bit bombastic and overly lengthy but no one else has
> registered a complaint as yet so it seems that folks here are fairly
> forgiving...which is good. The same concerns have arisen before on this
> list around political issues. The list master asserts that politics,
> even sexual politics, are within the purview of permaculture and so I
> have gone with the flow. I generally learn quickly what to delete and
> what to read given my own time and patience limitations.
> Sincerely,
> Keith
>
> Trudie Redding wrote:
> > Do you think you can find another list for this subject?
> >
> > Trudie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> > [mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Keith
> > Johnson
> > Sent: Monday, February 09, 2009 12:09 PM
> > To: Permaculture ibiblio
> > Subject: [permaculture] beautifully moving video
> >
> > http://www.couragecampaign.org/Divorce
> > <http://www.couragecampaign.org/page/ic/fne27arrb55jcv/SiFfQwwWBVE>
> >
> > Have you heard that Ken Starr -- and his Proposition 8 Legal Defense
> > Fund -- filed legal briefs defending the constitutionality of Prop 8 ...
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > permaculture mailing list
> > permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subscribe or unsubscribe here:
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> > Google command to search archives:
> > site:https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture searchstring
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
>
> Keith Johnson
> "Be fruitful and mulch apply."
> Permaculture Activist Magazine
> PO Box 5516, Bloomington, IN 47407
> (812) 335-0383
> - Permaculture Activist <http://www.permacultureactivist.net/>
> - Permaculture Trading Post <http://www.permaculturetradingpost.com/>
> - Patterns for Abundance Design & Consulting
> <http://www.permacultureactivist.net/design/Designconsult.html>
> - Permaculture & Regenerative Design News Blog
> <http://kjpermaculture.blogspot.com/>
> - APPLE (Alliance for Post-Petroleum Local Economics) It's a small world
> after oil. <http://www.relocalize.net/groups/applebloomington>
>
> - Transition Indiana <http://transitionindiana.blogspot.com/> - Blog
> <http://transitionindiana.blogspot.com/>
>
> - Transition Bloomington <http://transitionbloomingtonind.ning.com/>
> - Association for Regenerative Culture <http://www.arculture.org/>
> - The Gardeners' World Blog <http://theecosystem.blogspot.com/>
> - Renaissance Farm and Permaculture Center
> <http://bloomingtongrowers.locallygrown.net/growers/show/212>
> - Bloomington Permaculture Growers Cooperative
> <http://bloomingtongrowers.locallygrown.net/>
> - Bloomington Permaculture Guild Blog
> <http://bloomingtonpermacultureguild.blogspot.com/> - Calendar
> <http://my.calendars.net/bloomingtonpccal/>
> - Continental Bioregional Congress Blog
> <http://bioregional-congress.blogspot.com/>
> - Switch to Solar Power the Easy Way
> <http://www.jointhesolution.com/KeithJ-SunPower>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:31:58 -0800
> From: Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] list topics/ beautifully moving video
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <49921C7E.5030209@patternliteracy.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I'd also love it if when people post a link, they add a few words of
> description, instead of "this is really cool" or words to that effect.
> That might have saved Trudie and others some annoyance. I usually ignore
> mystery links; life is short, and the internet is deep.
>
> Since it seems we're going to get certain forwarded posts or links in
> spite of pleas not to, I support Keith's earlier idea that links, but
> not entire articles on environmental/political/economic nightmares, etc,
> be posted.
>
> People in Pc are generalists, so almost any topic is bound to be
> interesting to someone here, wildly OT or not. Like, right now I'd read
> an article on grouting tile. But just because someone here liked it, it
> doesn't follow that it belongs here.
>
> My personal criteria for posts (not including, of course, being sucked
> into meta-discussions like this one!) is to ask, will it help us become
> better permaculture designers? Thus in general, bad news doesn't make it
> since I doubt if anyone on this list really will get better at Pc design
> by hearing yet more horrors of climate change or bank bailouts.
>
> On another Pc list, someone just disregarded a plea to take a tedious
> 2-person OT dialog off-list with, essentially, "Permaculture is about
> everything, so I can post whatever I want." I hope you'll agree that
> besides being rude, that's a deeply flawed view of permaculture.
>
>
> Toby
> http://patternliteracy.com
>
>
> Keith Johnson wrote:
> > Trudie,
> > Sorry if I pushed your sense of limitations for this list but given the
> > behavior of other posters on the list I'm surprised you hadn't spoken up
> > sooner. The general consensus has been to use 'delete'. I happen to know
> > for certain that others on the list were grateful to receive it. There
> > are many other submissions to the list that annoy me, like those of
> > Nicholas Roberts whose submissions are rarely brief, generally numerous
> > and often "off-topic", and despite all that I generally appreciate the
> > guy himself and his underlying intentions. I personally feel that his
> > style is a bit bombastic and overly lengthy but no one else has
> > registered a complaint as yet so it seems that folks here are fairly
> > forgiving...which is good. The same concerns have arisen before on this
> > list around political issues. The list master asserts that politics,
> > even sexual politics, are within the purview of permaculture and so I
> > have gone with the flow. I generally learn quickly what to delete and
> > what to read given my own time and patience limitations.
> > Sincerely,
> > Keith
> >
> > Trudie Redding wrote:
> >
> >> Do you think you can find another list for this subject?
> >>
> >> Trudie
> >>
> >>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 20:58:22 -0500
> From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lflj@intrex.net>
> Subject: [permaculture] list topics/ beautifully moving video
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <499230BE.3050602@intrex.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> =
> https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/2009-February/032740.html
> =Toby Hemenway toby at patternliteracy.com
> =Tue Feb 10 19:31:58 EST 2009
>
> =I'd also love it if when people post a link, they add a few words of
> =description, instead of "this is really cool" or words to that effect.
> =That might have saved Trudie and others some annoyance. I usually ignore
> =mystery links; life is short, and the internet is deep.
>
> =Since it seems we're going to get certain forwarded posts or links in
> =spite of pleas not to, I support Keith's earlier idea that links, but
> =not entire articles on environmental/political/economic nightmares, etc,
> =be posted.
>
> =People in Pc are generalists, so almost any topic is bound to be
> =interesting to someone here, wildly OT or not. Like, right now I'd read
> =an article on grouting tile. But just because someone here liked it, it
> =doesn't follow that it belongs here.
>
> =My personal criteria for posts (not including, of course, being sucked
> =into meta-discussions like this one!) is to ask, will it help us become
> =better permaculture designers? Thus in general, bad news doesn't make it
> =since I doubt if anyone on this list really will get better at Pc design
> =by hearing yet more horrors of climate change or bank bailouts.
>
> =On another Pc list, someone just disregarded a plea to take a tedious
> =2-person OT dialog off-list with, essentially, "Permaculture is about
> =everything, so I can post whatever I want." I hope you'll agree that
> =besides being rude, that's a deeply flawed view of permaculture.
>
> That seems to sum up the most important issues regarding what should/should
> not
> be posted to this list.
>
> I enjoy Nicholas' posts and think they are valuable but they are long and
> numerous.
> Maybe he could just post a link with a synopsis instead of the full
> articles.
> Keith could post useful descriptions with his links. I, for one, will cease
> posting anything
> remotely political (i.e. my chronology of Tibetan human rights issues),
> even links.
>
> My Xpost of news about the Katz fermented foods workshop was, I thought,
> important for all of us to read, for health
> reasons plus sustainability and self-sufficiency. We all probably have
> favorite topics that we are certain are relevant
> in the context of permaculture; artistic license granted universally for
> this within reason; i.e. 20 successive posts
> from me about the benefits of eating fermented foods when one post filled
> with links would do.
>
> I do think it would be wise for all of us to post (as often as possible)
> material that will help all of us practice
> permaculture more wisely and to a greater depth, encompassing greater
> diversity to increase that knowledgebase and that
> pool of resources represented by this forum.
>
> Thanks, Toby, for getting the train back on the tracks.
>
> Lawrence
> Chapel Hill NC
> PC List Owner
> lflj@intrex.net
> 919 260 3030
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:08:59 -0500
> From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lflj@intrex.net>
> Subject: [permaculture] USDA-NRCS Pollination Survey for Agricultural
> Producers
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <4992333B.8050801@intrex.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
>
>
> http://lists.ifas.ufl.edu/cgi-bin/wa.exe?A2=ind0902&L=sanet-mg&T=0&O=D&P=53045
> SANET-MG<http://lists.ifas.ufl.edu/cgi-bin/wa.exe?A2=ind0902&L=sanet-mg&T=0&O=D&P=53045%0ASANET-MG>Archives
> -- February 2009 (#76)
> Subject: USDA-NRCS Pollination Survey for Agricultural Producers
> From: Eric Mader <[log in to unmask]>
> Reply-To: Sustainable Agriculture Network Discussion Group <[log in to
> unmask]>, Eric Mader <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:53:15 -0600
>
> Dear producers:
>
> The Xerces Society Pollinator Conservation Program is working with a number
> of organizations, including the USDA Natural Resources Conservation
> Service,
> to better deliver programs and services to agricultural producers
> throughout
> the country.
>
> To provide more relevant information to you and your fellow producers
> regarding crop pollinators and pollinator habitat, the NRCS is conducting a
> very brief survey to direct future communications efforts, and to more
> effectively address landowner needs.
>
> We're supportive of this important endeavor and ask that you please take a
> moment to provide them with your thoughts by completing the on-line survey
> at the following web address:
>
> http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=_2fELcMLt0RaLyWq86HVMq8A_3d_3d
>
> The survey should take less than three minutes to complete and your
> responses are completely confidential.
>
> Thank you in advance for your participation in the survey.
> Sincerely,
> Eric Mader
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 15:42:22 +1100
> From: Nicholas Roberts <nicholas@themediasociety.org>
> Subject: [permaculture] The GOP's Jihad on Obama
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID:
> <19281eab0902102042u593ec45amdaa2a3054dc0df1b@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> looks like the Obama honeymoon is over and that he has played himself,
> sadly
> just like Clinton. ... I hope not.. hope he can negotiate a FDR like New
> Deal Coalition... god I hope so...
>
> The GOP's Jihad on Obama
>
> By Robert Parry
> February 10, 2009
>
> Only a few weeks into Barack Obama's presidency, a threatening political
> and
> media dynamic has rushed to the fore cutting short a very brief honeymoon.
> Share this article
>
> Bookmark<javascript:location.href='
> http://del.icio.us/post?url='+urlEncode(location.href)+'&title='+document.title<http://del.icio.us/post?url=%27+urlEncode%28location.href%29+%27&title=%27+document.title>
> ;>
> [image: Digg!]Digg<javascript:location.href='
> http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url='+urlEncode(location.href)+'&title='+document.title<http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=%27+urlEncode%28location.href%29+%27&title=%27+document.title>
> ;>
>
> [image: email]Email
> <javascript:mailpage()>[image: print]Printer
> friendly<http://www.consortiumnews.com/Print/2009/021009.html>
>
> The Republicans and their right-wing media allies are doing whatever they
> can to strangle the Obama phenomenon in its cradle; the mainstream media
> pundits are stressing the negative so they don't get called "in the tank
> for
> Obama"; and the Democrats are shying away from holding the Bush-Cheney
> administration accountable for its crimes.
>
> None of these developments is particularly surprising. Indeed, they track
> closely to the political-media pattern that took shape the last time a
> young
> Democrat won the White House, when Bill Clinton became President in 1993.
>
> Then, the dispirited Republicans got a lift from the loud voice of a
> younger
> Rush Limbaugh who used his popular three-hour radio show to pillory Bill
> and
> Hillary Clinton. That, in turn, encouraged the congressional Republicans to
> vote as a bloc against President Clinton's budget and economic plan.
>
> Mainstream journalists also used the early Clinton years to disprove the
> Right's old canard about the "liberal press." As one senior news executive
> told me, "we're going to show that we can be tougher on a Democrat than any
> Republican."
>
> And the Democrats of 1993 also didn't want to investigate abuses by the
> Republicans who had just lost power. Despite evidence that the
> Reagan-Bush-41 administrations had obstructed investigations into
> Iran-Contra, Iraqgate and other national security scandals, Clinton and
> Democratic congressional leaders feared partisan warfare if those cases
> were
> pursued.
>
> Everyone in that 1993 mix seemed to be operating out of a logical
> self-interest ? the Republicans viewed Clinton as an interloper at their
> White House; the right-wing media desired larger market share and greater
> political influence; the mainstream media wanted to shake off the "liberal"
> tag; and the Democrats hoped to focus on the nation's deepening economic
> and
> social needs rather than on complex historical disputes.
>
> However, the result for the country from that intersection of
> self-interests
> proved disastrous.
>
> The Republican determination to destroy Clinton infected the political
> system with an ugly virus of hyper-partisanship; the right-wing media
> ramped
> up its hate talk; mainstream journalism lost its way, wandering into a
> strange landscape of garish sensationalism and shallow news reporting; and
> the Democrats failed to counteract the threat posed by the neoconservatives
> who surfaced during the national security scandals of the Reagan-Bush-41
> years.
>
> In short, the dynamic that took shape in 1993-94 carried the United States
> into the catastrophic presidency of George W. Bush just eight years later.
> [For details on how this happened, see Robert Parry's *Secrecy &
> Privilege<http://www.neckdeepbook.com/>
> *.]
>
> *Little Change*
>
> Now, at the other end of the Bush-43 experience, what may be most
> unsettling
> is that so little has changed, so few lessons have been learned.
>
> Even some of the key players are the same, with Rush Limbaugh hoping to
> reprise his role as the bombastic voice that lifts the Republicans out of
> their post-election funk. And the new GOP players in Congress seem to be
> following the hand-me-down playbook from that earlier era.
>
> So, House Republicans hailed their unanimous bloc vote against President
> Obama's $819 billion stimulus package as their first substantive step back.
> That was followed by key Republicans ? Mitch McConnell, John McCain and
> Lindsey Graham ? refusing to join in any serious negotiations with
> Democrats
> in the Senate.
>
> With the Republican Senate leaders vowing to filibuster the stimulus bill ?
> thus forcing the Democrats to round up 60 votes ? the Republicans were
> almost gleeful in their insurrection. The Washington Post quoted key
> Republicans expressing this exhilaration in a front-page story entitled
> "GOP
> Sees Positives in Negative
> Stand<
> http://mobile.washingtonpost.com/detail.jsp?key=348912&rc=po&p=1&all=1>
> ."
>
> "We're so far ahead of where we thought we'd be at this time," said Rep.
> Paul D. Ryan of Wisconsin, a backbencher eager to take a leadership role.
> "It's not a sign that we're back to where we need to be, but it's a sign
> that we're beginning to find our voice."
>
> "What transpired," said Rep. Eric Cantor of Virginia, the second-ranking
> House Republican, "and will give us a shot in the arm going forward is that
> we are standing up on principle and just saying no." [Washington Post, Feb.
> 9, 2009 <http://mobile.washingtonpost.com/news.jsp?key=348912&rc=po>]
>
> One excited Republican congressman ? Pete Sessions of Texas ? went even
> further, comparing the GOP insurrectionist tactics to those of the Taliban,
> the radical Islamic group that is battling U.S. forces in Afghanistan and
> has been allied with Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda terrorist group.
>
> "Insurgency, we understand perhaps a little bit more because of the
> Taliban," Sessions said during a meeting with editors of the National
> Journal's Hotline<
> http://hotlineoncall.nationaljournal.com/archives/2009/02/sessions_gop_in.php
> >.
> "And that is that they went about systematically understanding how to
> disrupt and change a person's entire processes."
>
> Sessions caught himself slightly, adding:
>
> *"*I'm not trying to say the Republican Party is the Taliban. No, that's
> not
> what we're saying. I'm saying [that] we need to understand that insurgency
> may be required when the other side, the House leadership, does not follow
> the same commands, which we entered the game with."
>
> *Tight Vote*
>
> In the Senate, only three Republicans ? Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins and
> Arlen Specter ? crossed the aisle to support a compromise stimulus bill
> that
> gained their support by increasing the proportion of tax cuts and by
> reducing spending on schools and aid to hard-pressed state governments.
>
> Their votes became crucial for the bill to gain a 60-vote super-majority to
> cut off debate. After clearing the Senate, 61-37, on Tuesday, the stimulus
> bill goes to a conference with the House to iron out differences.
>
> Besides the reemerging behavioral patterns of the Republicans, many
> Democrats also are acting like it's 1993 all over again. Despite blunt
> admissions by President George W. Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney that
> they ordered waterboarding and other brutal interrogation techniques, the
> Democrats have shied away from any legal confrontation over whether to hold
> Bush and Cheney accountable for criminal violations.
>
> Instead, there's been talk about, maybe, a "truth and reconciliation
> commission" that won't seek to embarrass anyone and ? through grants of
> immunity ? may make any criminal prosecutions impossible. [See
> Consortiumnews.com's "Leahy Calls for Truth
> Commission<http://www.consortiumnews.com/2009/020909a.html>
> ."]
>
> Another reflection from the historical mirror of 1993 is the asymmetry of
> media power. Then, like now, there was a scarcity of well-organized
> independent or progressive media, only a handful of under-funded magazines
> and some small FM radio stations up against a fast-growing right-wing media
> machine.
>
> Over the past 16 years, independent and progressive outlets have gained a
> toehold in the national debate ? mostly through the Internet and a few
> cable
> TV shows ? but the balance remains heavily tilted toward the right-wing
> side, which invests vastly more money in virtually every media sector, from
> books, magazines and newspapers to radio, TV and the Internet.
>
> This imbalance enabled the Republicans to throw the Obama administration
> onto the defensive by cherry-picking a few questionable items in the
> stimulus bill and making them the center of the national debate for several
> days. The independent/progressive media side proved woefully inadequate in
> countering that initial thrust.
>
> So far, however, the key difference-maker in the economic debate has been
> the President himself. Despite all the TV jibber-jabber about Obama's
> stumbles, he demonstrated his ability to reach past the Washington chatter
> and connect with an American public that, according to polls, wishes him
> well and desperately wants him to succeed.
>
> Obama's town-hall meetings in the hard-hit communities of Elkhart, Indiana,
> on Monday and Fort Myers, Florida, on Tuesday ? as well as his strong
> performance in a televised news conference on Monday night ? left millions
> of Americans delighted to have a President who could both speak in
> paragraphs and cite down-home examples of how his stimulus package would
> help common folk.
>
> People in the audiences nodded at his explanations about money to winterize
> homes or to modernize schools or to build a first-class infrastructure. A
> refrain also kept popping up in questions, references to "for the first
> time
> in eight years," an implicit contrast to Bush's inarticulate oratory.
>
> Obama's speaking skill and personal charm may go a long way toward blunting
> Republican hopes for a repeat of the nasty partisan fights of 1993-94 ?
> which ended up with the GOP winning both chambers of Congress, Rush
> Limbaugh
> becoming an honorary member of the new House majority, and House Speaker
> Newt Gingrich launching his "Republican Revolution."
>
> But except for Obama's prodigious abilities -- and an American public that
> may have lost its patience for some of the Washington gamesmanship -- there
> are eerie parallels to the start of the last Democratic presidency 16 years
> ago.
>
> *Robert Parry broke many of the Iran-Contra stories in the 1980s for the
> Associated Press and Newsweek. His latest book, Neck Deep: The Disastrous
> Presidency of George W. Bush, was written with two of his sons, Sam and
> Nat,
> and can be ordered at neckdeepbook.com <http://www.neckdeepbook.com/>. His
> two previous books, Secrecy & Privilege: The Rise of the Bush Dynasty from
> Watergate to Iraq and Lost History: Contras, Cocaine, the Press & 'Project
> Truth' are also available there. Or go to
> Amazon.com<
> http://www.amazon.com/Neck-Deep-Disastrous-Presidency-George/dp/1893517020/ref=ed_oe_h/105-6934069-6141258?ie=UTF8&qid=1189519378&sr=8-1
> >.
> *
>
> *To comment at Consortiumblog, click here <http://consortiumblog.com/>.
> (To
> make a blog comment about this or other stories, you can use your normal
> e-mail address and password. Ignore the prompt for a Google account.) To
> comment to us by e-mail, click
> here<http://www.consortiumnews.com/contact.html>.
> * *To donate so we can continue reporting and publishing stories like the
> one you just read, click
> here<
> https://secure.democracyinaction.org/dia/organizations/consortiumnews/shop/custom.jsp?donate_page_KEY=2043
> >
> .*
>
> --
> Nicholas Roberts
> [im] skype:niccolor
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:54:02 -0500
> From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lflj@intrex.net>
> Subject: [permaculture] The GOP's Jihad on Obama
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <499259EA.7090209@intrex.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> =https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture/2009-February/032743.html
> =[permaculture] The GOP's Jihad on Obama
> =Nicholas Roberts nicholas at themediasociety.org
> =Tue Feb 10 23:42:22 EST 2009
>
> =looks like the Obama honeymoon is over and that he has played himself,
> sadly
> =just like Clinton. ... I hope not.. hope he can negotiate a FDR like New
> =Deal Coalition... god I hope so...
>
> =The GOP's Jihad on Obama
>
> This one is really OT ; time to C&D politics and stick to PC.
>
> OT = off topic
> C&D = cease & desist
> PC = permaculture
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:44:36 -0800 (PST)
> From: "Jordan Fink" <jordan@riseup.net>
> Subject: [permaculture] Portland, OR. Permaculture Course with Marisha
> Auerbach, Jordan Fink, Henry Stanley and others.
> To: "Portland Permaculture Guild" <ppg@lists.riseup.net>,
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org, Community@ancestralways.net
> Message-ID: <jordan.1234331076.squirrel@tern.riseup.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
> We have some openings for our TrackersNW Permaculture Course!
>
> This course is roughly 4 months long and happens tuesdays, with 3 multiple
> day sections. This is a chance to take experience the Immersion Program,
> and get your permaculture design certification.
>
> Join the TrackersNW immersion team in a cutting edge style of learning and
> participation. Study techniques, skills, and timeless knowledge that will
> give you the ability to live with the environment around you in a holistic
> and regenerative way. Attend classes in both the urban and rural setting
> and then put your new knowledge to work creating a design for 2.5 acres of
> gorgeous land bordering 400 acres of wilderness. Bring back the caretaker
> of the land philosophy that could help us live at peace with the Earth
> again.
>
> Some of the topics include:
> Design Methodoligies
> Appropriate Technology
> Natural Building
> Plant Propagation
> GreyWater
> Bioremediation
> Reading the Landscape
> Composting
> Food Preservation
> Soil Food Web Gardening
> Compost Tea Brewing
> Rocket Stoves
> Rainwater Harvesting
> Community Building
> Seed Saving
> Wildcrafting, Harvesting
> Landscape Design
> Disaster Scenarios
> Grafting and Budding
> Guerilla Gardening
> Sustainable Urban Design
> Low Tech Mushroom Growing
> Emergency Preparedness
> Disaster Scenarios
> Grafting, Budding, and Pruning
>
> Our permaculture course will run on student collaboration with the
> instructors in question-led discussions, scenario-based design and
> facilitated long-term projects.
> We include and hands-on "take homes" that you make and keep (potential
> projects: pocket rocket stove, compost tea, grafted fruit tree, mushroom
> cultivation + more). We cover applications for diverse climates and
> lifestyles, from intentional eco villager to rural homesteader to the
> urban rewild nomad.
>
> Teachers Include:
>
> Marisha Auerbach - Marisha has been practicing, studying, and teaching
> permaculture in the Pacific Northwest for the past ten years. Marisha is
> working to support the paradigm shift through sharing knowledge with
> others on a variety of topics including: permaculture, flower and gem
> essences, local economics, community building, ethnobotany, herbalism,
> edible landscape design, and organic gardening among others. She is
> enthusiastic about creating perennial forage systems and building local
> community as a response to peak oil. Marisha's interest in local economics
> and creating useful items using her resources manifests as several
> projects: working on a local community marketplace in Olympia, Queen Bee
> Flower and Gem Essences, Herb'n Wisdom for permaculture consulting and
> herbal products, and Growing Greetings which produces plantable greeting
> cards and other products. Marisha graduated from the Evergreen State
> College in 1998 where she focused on ethnobotany, ecological agriculture,
> and sustainability studies.
>
> Jordan Fink, Wapato Ecological Design - Permaculture teacher and
> Ethnoecologist. At age 14, helped Co-Found The City Repair Project in
> Portland Oregon. He's interested in the interrelationship between
> landscape and culture and has studied ethnography, place-making,
> spacial/ethical patterning and initiation, perennial polyculture food
> systems, and Cascadian botany, ethnoecology and plant physiology.
>
> Henry Stanley - Gardening since the age of 8, when Henry won first prize
> for a purple cabbage at the Tillamook County Fair, He is now a
> Permaculture Landscaper, Fermented Foods maker, Boat Builder and Graphic
> Designer. Urban Food Forest - Landscape Design and Consultation
> http://www.urbanfoodforest.com
>
> Who Adults, 16 & up
> Schedule
> February 24, 25 Overnights
> March 3
> March 10
> March 31
> April 7
> April 21
> April 28, 29, 30 Overnights
> May 5
> May 12
> May 19
> May 26, 27 Overnights
> Locations Miller Cabin, Sandy, Oregon Urban gardens in Portland, Oregon
>
>
> Cost $950 11 spots available
>
>
> go to trackersnw.com for more information and to register
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:59:44 -0500
> From: Mike McGregor <split005@hotmail.com>
> Subject: [permaculture] pc design courses in India or other eastern
> countries?
> To: <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <BAY116-W37FF70AB24C4B0CF05B90C88BA0@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
>
> Does anyone know of any pc design courses coming up in the next 3-6 months
> in India?
> Thanks.
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Twice the fun?Share photos while you chat with Windows Live Messenger.
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/products/messenger.aspx
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 04:14:45 -0500
> From: Hannah Roessler <hannahroessler@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] pc design courses in India or other
> eastern countries?
> To: <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <COL106-W29979AEF1CD0D2392814EECCBA0@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
>
> Hello Mike,
> I don't know of any pc courses, but if you are in northern India I would
> suggest checking out Navdanya, which is an organization founded by Vandana
> Shiva. They have educational courses on a variety of things surrounding
> organic farming and indigenous knowledge.
> http://www.navdanya.org/index.htm
> I hope you have a safe and inspiring journey.
> Cheers,
> Hannah
>
>
> > From: split005@hotmail.com
> > To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> > Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:59:44 -0500
> > Subject: [permaculture] pc design courses in India or other eastern
> countries?
> >
> >
> > Does anyone know of any pc design courses coming up in the next 3-6
> months in India?
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Twice the fun?Share photos while you chat with Windows Live Messenger.
> > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/products/messenger.aspx
> > _______________________________________________
> > permaculture mailing list
> > permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subscribe or unsubscribe here:
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> > Google command to search archives:
> > site:https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture searchstring
> >
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live Messenger. Multitasking at its finest.
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/products/messenger.aspx
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 05:43:18 -0800
> From: Wesley Roe and Santa Barbara Permaculture Network
> <lakinroe@silcom.com>
> Subject: [permaculture] pc design courses in India or other eastern
> countries?
> To: <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <p06240804c5b88548f1a1@[67.150.13.142]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
>
> hi
> two teachers that have taught pc courses in India recently
>
> "Richard Zook" <richard@lamafoundation.org>
> <http://www.ricoclime.com>www.ricoclime.com
>
> Warren Brush
> <w@quailsprings.org><http://www.quailsprings.org/>www.quailsprings.org
>
> wes
>
> Does anyone know of any pc design courses coming up in the next 3-6
> months in India?
> Thanks.
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Twice the fun-Share photos while you chat with Windows Live Messenger.
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/products/messenger.aspx
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> Subscribe or unsubscribe here:
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> Google command to search archives:
> site:https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture searchstring
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:46:59 -0700
> From: "Scott Pittman" <scott@permaculture.org>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] Need top bar beehive design specs
> To: "'permaculture'" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <29A3E106DE2140D99A9D5DB63EA13407@1050A33921534E2>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Also check www.permaculture.org under beekeeping class.
>
> Scott Pittman
> Director
> Permaculture Institute
> www.permaculture.org
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of chauncey
> williams
> Sent: Monday, February 09, 2009 10:17 PM
> To: permaculture
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] Need top bar beehive design specs
>
> Sorry, try this link.
> http://www.biobees.com/index.php
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 10:40:25 -0700
> From: "Scott Pittman" <scott@permaculture.org>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] list topics/ beautifully moving video
> To: "'permaculture'" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <862C3A5412624AD19974BEFE8EDCD7CB@1050A33921534E2>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Just to join the dog pile, I agree with both Keith and Toby.
>
> Over time I think that this list has become a grab bag of different
> "causes"
> some of which I support and some which I don't but all of which I have
> already seen on other lists and blogs and don't need to see again. What
> really draws me to this list is the fact that I hear new design ideas from
> all over the world that I can use in my own practice and teaching.
>
> I would enjoy this site more if people would bridle their urge to urge
> others to join their cause(s) through long reprints of articles etc. Links
> are certainly sufficient with a brief heading or description of content.
>
> My grandma used to say "Some people can't help it, they just talk to hear
> their head rattle."
>
> My two cents,
>
> Scott Pittman
> Director
> Permaculture Institute
> www.permaculture.org
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Toby Hemenway
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 5:32 PM
> To: permaculture
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] list topics/ beautifully moving video
>
> I'd also love it if when people post a link, they add a few words of
> description, instead of "this is really cool" or words to that effect.
> That might have saved Trudie and others some annoyance. I usually ignore
> mystery links; life is short, and the internet is deep.
>
> Since it seems we're going to get certain forwarded posts or links in
> spite of pleas not to, I support Keith's earlier idea that links, but
> not entire articles on environmental/political/economic nightmares, etc,
> be posted.
>
> People in Pc are generalists, so almost any topic is bound to be
> interesting to someone here, wildly OT or not. Like, right now I'd read
> an article on grouting tile. But just because someone here liked it, it
> doesn't follow that it belongs here.
>
> My personal criteria for posts (not including, of course, being sucked
> into meta-discussions like this one!) is to ask, will it help us become
> better permaculture designers? Thus in general, bad news doesn't make it
> since I doubt if anyone on this list really will get better at Pc design
> by hearing yet more horrors of climate change or bank bailouts.
>
> On another Pc list, someone just disregarded a plea to take a tedious
> 2-person OT dialog off-list with, essentially, "Permaculture is about
> everything, so I can post whatever I want." I hope you'll agree that
> besides being rude, that's a deeply flawed view of permaculture.
>
>
> Toby
> http://patternliteracy.com
>
>
> Keith Johnson wrote:
> > Trudie,
> > Sorry if I pushed your sense of limitations for this list but given the
> > behavior of other posters on the list I'm surprised you hadn't spoken up
> > sooner. The general consensus has been to use 'delete'. I happen to know
> > for certain that others on the list were grateful to receive it. There
> > are many other submissions to the list that annoy me, like those of
> > Nicholas Roberts whose submissions are rarely brief, generally numerous
> > and often "off-topic", and despite all that I generally appreciate the
> > guy himself and his underlying intentions. I personally feel that his
> > style is a bit bombastic and overly lengthy but no one else has
> > registered a complaint as yet so it seems that folks here are fairly
> > forgiving...which is good. The same concerns have arisen before on this
> > list around political issues. The list master asserts that politics,
> > even sexual politics, are within the purview of permaculture and so I
> > have gone with the flow. I generally learn quickly what to delete and
> > what to read given my own time and patience limitations.
> > Sincerely,
> > Keith
> >
> > Trudie Redding wrote:
> >
> >> Do you think you can find another list for this subject?
> >>
> >> Trudie
> >>
> >>
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> Subscribe or unsubscribe here:
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
> Google command to search archives:
> site:https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/permaculture searchstring
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.20/1943 - Release Date: 2/10/2009
> 7:20 AM
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:19:31 -0500
> From: Keith Johnson <keithdj@mindspring.com>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] list topics
> To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <499316B3.40605@mindspring.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Excellent Scott. Three cheers for brevity. I will further adapt
> accordingly.
>
> Scott Pittman wrote:
> > Just to join the dog pile, I agree with both Keith and Toby.
> >
> > I would enjoy this site more if people would bridle their urge to urge
> > others to join their cause(s) through long reprints of articles etc.
> Links
> > are certainly sufficient with a brief heading or description of content.
> >
> > My grandma used to say "Some people can't help it, they just talk to hear
> > their head rattle."
> > My two cents,
> > Scott Pittma
> --
>
> Keith Johnson
> "Be fruitful and mulch apply."
> Permaculture Activist Magazine
> PO Box 5516, Bloomington, IN 47407
> (812) 335-0383
> - Permaculture Activist <http://www.permacultureactivist.net/>
> - Permaculture Trading Post <http://www.permaculturetradingpost.com/>
> - Patterns for Abundance Design & Consulting
> <http://www.permacultureactivist.net/design/Designconsult.html>
> - Permaculture & Regenerative Design News Blog
> <http://kjpermaculture.blogspot.com/>
> - APPLE (Alliance for Post-Petroleum Local Economics) It's a small world
> after oil. <http://www.relocalize.net/groups/applebloomington>
>
> - Transition Indiana <http://transitionindiana.blogspot.com/> - Blog
> <http://transitionindiana.blogspot.com/>
>
> - Transition Bloomington <http://transitionbloomingtonind.ning.com/>
> - Association for Regenerative Culture <http://www.arculture.org/>
> - The Gardeners' World Blog <http://theecosystem.blogspot.com/>
> - Renaissance Farm and Permaculture Center
> <http://bloomingtongrowers.locallygrown.net/growers/show/212>
> - Bloomington Permaculture Growers Cooperative
> <http://bloomingtongrowers.locallygrown.net/>
> - Bloomington Permaculture Guild Blog
> <http://bloomingtonpermacultureguild.blogspot.com/> - Calendar
> <http://my.calendars.net/bloomingtonpccal/>
> - Continental Bioregional Congress Blog
> <http://bioregional-congress.blogspot.com/>
> - Switch to Solar Power the Easy Way
> <http://www.jointhesolution.com/KeithJ-SunPower>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
>
>
> End of permaculture Digest, Vol 73, Issue 16
> ********************************************
>



--
_____________

alchemyarch.net
_____________



  • Re: [permaculture] permaculture Digest, Vol 73, Issue 16, Martin Mikush, 02/11/2009

Archive powered by MHonArc 2.6.24.

Top of Page