permaculture

["jamie nicol" <jamie@tiscali.fr>]

Hello Lisa, I certainly think the past can shed light on the present, in
agriculture as in everything else, despite our common cultural bias
implicitly accepting of the idea of progress. This concept would have it
that the past might be occasionally interesting, the source of a few good
stories but really can't help us because it speaks of a time from which we
have come, a time that we have surpassed ('surpassed' I'm using not only to
mark the passage of time but to give the idea we have overcome it).
However, I do not believe like many others that we repeat ourselves either:
the agricultural situation in the later Roman Empire and the current
situation in much of the West is the same but different, in the same way
that Heracleitos spoke of never stepping into the same river twice. History
is illustrative and thus helpful for perhaps understanding our position from
another angle.
        If I may take advantage of your specialization and ask an 
environmental
archaeology question: to what extent are Marija Gambutas' ideas on a
pre-Indo-European culture based on equality between the sexes under the
blessings of a mother goddess and practicing sustainable agriculture born
out by archaeological records? Or, to put it more succinctly: Was there a
truly nature-centred agricultural culture?
        For those never having heard of Gambutas' this is how she represents 
her
ideas of this old culture and its subjugation by the Indo-Europeans as the
moved west across the continent:

"We are still living under the sway of that aggressive male invasion and
only beginning to discover our long alienation from our authentic European
Heritage...non-violent, earth-centred culture...and its symbolic language ,
whose vestiges remain enmeshed in our own system of symbols."


The past is indeed another country, but it has its practical uses.


Jamie
Souscayrous


-----Original Message-----
From: permaculture-admin@lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:permaculture-admin@lists.ibiblio.org]On Behalf Of Gray, Lisa
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2002 2:03 PM
To: 'permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org'
Subject: RE: [permaculture] Pc and large scale farms

Dear Jamie and all,

I've just had a very quick scan (at work at present) of your email and feel
you've picked up on something dear to my heart. I believe that the only
valid reason for studying the past is to learn form it to look for trends
nad to improve the way we are working with the land today. I'm an
environmental archaeologist, unfortunately not in the position to research
this theme at present (though if I won our national lottery I'd jump at the
chance to do a PhD linking archaseobotany with permaculture!), but I bear it
in mind in my work and my permacultural interests. If anyone wants to ask
specific plant history related questions a good list is the archaeobotany
mailing list. I'm sure my colleagues would enjoy a debate putting our work
in a practical and useful context. I hope I've read your mail correctly ;-).


best wishes,


Lisa

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Lisa Gray
Archaeobotanist
Environmental Archaeology Section
Museum of London Specialist Services
TEL: 0207 5669334