permaculture

[FranksFarm@aol.com]

Good morning:)

In a message dated 8/6/02 5:14:13 PM, mpludwig@facstaff.wisc.edu writes:

<< You might want to invest in a "land leveler" or at least 
big ole bucket for the front end loader with a pair of those grabbing forks 
to move big piles of junk.  Might look at using some of your poor spots in 
the pastures as a dumping area for this stuff. >>

I too like the "idea". There are actually quite a few places where this storm 
debris would help the lay of the land. The real killer is the time, and 
difficulty involved in trying to collect it all. First I'd need to get the 
stuff off 5000' of barbed wire fence; then I'd need to use forks or chains to 
move really big stuff from the middle of the field to a big brush pile. And 
of course the distance to the brush pile is another. It's also real tough to 
easily get into a bucket due to proximity to the fence, and the 
tangled/settled debris.

A dump truck, which I don't have or have access to, would be useful. So too 
might a plow blade on the tractor...if I had one.

Seems like a lot of machinery is required! UGH!

Re: Planting Trees

Mark writes:

>>I wouldn't use willows.  While they are a good tree for this application, 
they will catch junk and make pasture management harder.>>

Me neither! I have a strip of woods right alongside creek that varies in 
depth from 20' or so to close to 100'. There are all sorts of trees in here 
that have just sort of grown up over time. Many are well over a foot in 
diameter. There are black cherry, elder berry, osage orange,willow, sycamore, 
and walnut. Walnut seem to dominate area closest to farm road...furthest from 
creek.

Many of the smaller trees have such shallow root systems that storms and high 
winds can push them over, or else are easily damaged. I've cut down lots of 
wild grape vines so thick that they can literally bend over good sized trees, 
and entangle the canopy of several nearby trees as well.

Lots of downed, woody material in this strip. It is also choked with small 
vines,wild roses...which I also have been cutting down ruthlessly since they 
not only take over large areas, but can also really rip you up as you try and 
walk through area for any reason.

Eventually I'd like to turn this area into a more open park like area with 
lots of shrubs, native plants,wildflowers and grasses( that can tolerate some 
shade, and wet feet) in the understory. 

No order of any kind. Some large trees are dying. There's quite a large 
number of smaller 2-3" diameter trees growing in the understory. Most are 
rather poor specimens since they are often shaded over by larger trees, and 
desperately bend, and turn towards what light is available.

The other key feature of this strip is the varied depth and width channels 
carved out by the creek's overflowing it's banks every few years or so. I'm 
debating if I should use these as good spots for filling with woody debris or 
if the next flood will only cause me a lot more work by possibly washing it 
back onto the bottom fields rather than carrying them off down stream.

This normally, gentle two foot deep creek can move a lot of material quickly 
during heavy rains. It swells up in a hurry, but also drains so quickly that 
sometimes within a few hours it can be several feet lower than high-water 
mark.

How about some practical PC tips for this area which also serves as cover for 
wildlife.
I'd like to develop the area for multi-use purposes, including wildlife, and 
a few picnic areas, glades, etc., where there is already some grass. This too 
is a multiyear project:)

By the way this particular section of the Creek causes far more damage to my 
farm than others on it because there is an almost 90 degree bend at the top 
of the creek on my south west boundary. Seems during times of flash floods 
water cannot make turn easily enough so it simply washes over the banks at 
that spot, and a few others where the creek narrows, or where islands or land 
extensions have been created.

I'd love to hear more from you all:)   Frank