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Subject: Percy-L: Literary, Religious, Scientific, and Philosophical Discussion on Walker Percy

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  • From: "Marcus" <marcus AT loyno.edu>
  • To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [percy-l] Percy-L Digest, Vol 39, Issue 3
  • Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 07:21:44 -0500

I can vouch that Percy did read Julian Jaynes. When JJ's
book appeared in the late 1970s, I read it and so did Percy
at about the same time. I vaguely recall him chuckling
about how extravagant Jaynes' theory was. Nothing beyond
this.

Percy did scribble in his books as he read them. If this is
a BIG project for you (i.e. a dissertation or a book or
article), you might check to see if Percy's copy of OCBBM is
in his library. The person to contact, I think, would be
Mrs. Percy.

Karey, since you are reading Jaynes now, what about
energizing this list during the summer doldrums by
addressing some of the questions you ask? How do you think
Jaynes' thoughts stand up today? (And isn't it 24 years
since Bicameral Mind appeared?)

Marcus Smith

----- Original Message Follows -----
From: percy-l-request AT lists.ibiblio.org
To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Percy-L Digest, Vol 39, Issue 3
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 03:44:11 -0400

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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: "American Dream" (Lawrence Rhu)
> 2. consciousness, Julian Jaynes, and Percy (Karey
> Perkins)
> 3. Re: "American Dream" (Beck, David A)
> 4. Re: "American Dream" (Karey Perkins)
> 5. Re: "American Dream" (JHForest AT cs.com)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> ------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2006 20:30:36 -0400
> From: "Lawrence Rhu" <rhul AT gwm.sc.edu>
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "American Dream"
> To: <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <s4ac2180.022 AT gwm.sc.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> Jim--
>
> Pity indeed. I take your point without any comfort to
> offer. The crisis in humanities publishing continues, and
> university presses have had to take drastic measures to
> survive. Of course, these include such prohibitively high
> prices, more limited printings, fewer paperbacks at least
> vaguely in the purchasable range, etc. Still, I am
> pleased that you express some interest. Thanks.
>
> Larry
>
> Lawrence F. Rhu
> Associate Professor of English and Comparative Literature
> University of South Carolina
> Columbia, SC 29208
> Tel: 803 777 0144
> Fax: 803 777 9064
> Email: rhul AT sc.edu
>
> >>> JHForest AT cs.com 07/04/06 6:13 AM >>>
> >> The pleasure and satisfaction of having a new book just
> out have irresistibly combined with the easy availability
> of an appropriate listserv and a "hard url" to make
> advertising its recent publication almost effortless. As
> you may recall, I have previously mentioned the presence
> of Percy and especially The Movigoer in my book as a
> matter of possible interest for subscribers to this list.
> So here it is, just a click away (with my sincere
> apologies for the price). <<
> >>
>
http://www.cas.sc.edu/engl/faculty/faculty_pages/rhu/cavell.html
>
> What a fine title and inviting cover! But what a pity that
> it costs so much. I fear this will put it beyond the
> budget of many who might have wished to buy a copy,
> myself included.
>
> Jim Forest
>
> * * *
> Jim and Nancy Forest
> Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
> tel: (31)(72) 511 2545
> Jim's e-mail: jhforest AT cs.com (alternative address:
> jhforest AT gmail.com) Nancy's e-mail: forestflier AT cs.com
> (alternative address: forestflier AT gmail.com)
> Jim and Nancy Forest web site:
> www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ Forest-Flier Editorial
> Services: www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ffes/ Jim's
> photo web site: www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
> Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: www.incommunion.org *
> * *
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 23:55:40 -0400
> From: "Karey Perkins" <karey AT kareyperkins.com>
> Subject: [percy-l] consciousness, Julian Jaynes, and Percy
> To: "'Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion'"
> <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <005501c6a0b0$0c857940$0301000a@KAREY>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I am reading Julian Jaynes's The Origin of Consciousness
> and the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, C 1976, 1990. He
> discusses the evolution of language.
>
>
>
> Questions:
>
>
>
> 1) Did Percy read Jaynes? If so, his opinion?
>
> 2) How might he have responded, in your opinion, if he
> had read him?
>
> 3) Did Jaynes know of Percy? He does cite Peirce, ever
> so briefly, but not Percy, Langer, or Cassirer.
>
> 4) What is the general consensus of the mind-body and/or
> semiotic community on Jaynes?
>
> 5) Has anyone on the list read Jaynes?
>
> 6) How does Jaynes' thoughts stand up today? (16 years
> after last printing)
>
> 7) What do you think of Jaynes? What is the value of his
> book/thoughts?
>
> 8) Any other thoughts?
>
>
>
> I do remember Mike Frentz differentiating between the more
> scientific approaches to semiotics/consciousness and the
> more humanistic approaches, with Jaynes in the former camp
> and Percy in the latter.. I've heard this book is an
> important one -
>
>
>
> Karey
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 23:56:30 -0400
> From: "Beck, David A" <dabeck AT iupui.edu>
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "American Dream"
> To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID:
> <20060705235630.10s62jue5cgso0w8 AT webmail.iu.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1;
> format="flowed"
>
> Larry, Jim et al,
> I think that you are both correct. University presses
> aren't producing Dan Brown-like bestsellers. My hunch is
> that the reason the books are so high (besides the legit
> reasons Larry gave) is that they expect libraries to be
> their main customers. Hence they can gouge libraries and
> forget the mass market. The upside of all of this is that
> the amazon market place offers most of these books at a
> reasonable price. My academic mentor in grad school (the
> late Tony Sherrill) published a great book that also
> discussed Percy (Road-Book America). It had a similiar
> price, but I found it in the used marketplace of amazon
> for half-price (and it looked like it had never been
> opened). The problem, of course, is that the author
> probably won't receive any royalties. But, if you are
> like me and just want the book to be read, the internet
> offers some great deals. I receive such a small commission
> on my books that I'd rather give them away to more people
> than receive the chump change I get for each book sold.
> I wrote two obscure (small press) books on Eastern
> Orthodoxy a decade or so ago. I'm amazed to see that some
> book sellers are offering each book at $40 or more. If
> someone goes via the publisher s/he can get each book for
> under $12 (paperback). Anyway, I am going to ask our
> university library to purchase the book, if they haven't
> already ordered it. Looks good and I look forward to
> reading it. BTW, as a follow up to the last discussion I
> brought up (on The Moviegoer), I'll dive into that book
> next week. I plan to give a big intro, using some of the
> work that Karey and Rhonda provided me. I'll have to
> admit, however, that I am still a little hesitant. Today
> we concluded our poetry section. I thought that it would
> be cool to use some song lyrics. I chose Springsteen's
> "Thunder Road", Counting Crows' "Round Here" and Jakob
> Dylan's (the Wallflowers), "One Headlight." 2/3rds of my
> students weren't familiar enough with Springsteen to be
> able to name ONE song he wrote/sung. They thought that
> Counting Crows were from "my" generation (I'm 47!!!).
> I felt so old that I thought I'd should ask for a handicap
> parking sticker. I mean, I asked, didn't you guys ever
> "roll down the windows and let the wind blow back your
> hair"?? If Springsteen is so dated, how will they get
> Bill Holden and Rory Calhoun?? Sorry, I won't go on, in
> fear that no one here will get it either. Feeling old in
> Indy ("I shall wear the bottoms of my trousers
> rolled"--no, wait, "I shall wear my trousers sagging").
> Time to go to bed (no mermaids sing to me). -David
>
>
>
> Quoting Lawrence Rhu <rhul AT gwm.sc.edu>:
>
> > Jim--
> >
> > Pity indeed. I take your point without any comfort to
> > offer. The crisis in humanities publishing continues,
> > and university presses have had to take drastic measures
> > to survive. Of course, these include such prohibitively
> > high prices, more limited printings, fewer paperbacks at
> > least vaguely in the purchasable range, etc. Still, I
> am pleased that you express some interest. Thanks. >
> > Larry
> >
> > Lawrence F. Rhu
> > Associate Professor of English and Comparative
> > Literature University of South Carolina
> > Columbia, SC 29208
> > Tel: 803 777 0144
> > Fax: 803 777 9064
> > Email: rhul AT sc.edu
> >
> >>>> JHForest AT cs.com 07/04/06 6:13 AM >>>
> >>> The pleasure and satisfaction of having a new book
> > just out have irresistibly combined with the easy
> > availability of an appropriate listserv and a "hard
> > url" to make advertising its recent publication almost
> > effortless. As you may recall, I have previously
> > mentioned the presence of Percy and especially The
> Movigoer in my book as a matter of possible interest for
> > subscribers to this list. So here it is, just a click
> > away (with my sincere apologies for the price). <<
> >>>
>
http://www.cas.sc.edu/engl/faculty/faculty_pages/rhu/cavell.html
> >
> > What a fine title and inviting cover! But what a pity
> > that it costs so much. I fear this will put it beyond
> > the budget of many who might have wished to buy
> > a copy, myself included.
> >
> > Jim Forest
> >
> > * * *
> > Jim and Nancy Forest
> > Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
> > tel: (31)(72) 511 2545
> > Jim's e-mail: jhforest AT cs.com (alternative address:
> > jhforest AT gmail.com) Nancy's e-mail: forestflier AT cs.com
> > (alternative address: forestflier AT gmail.com)
> > Jim and Nancy Forest web site:
> > www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ Forest-Flier Editorial
> > Services: www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ffes/ Jim's
> > photo web site: www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
> > Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: www.incommunion.org
> * * * >
> > --
> > An archive of all list discussion is available at
> > https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
> >
> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at
> http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy >
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 00:58:28 -0400
> From: "Karey Perkins" <karey AT kareyperkins.com>
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "American Dream"
> To: "'Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion'"
> <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <006201c6a0b8$d273d130$0301000a@KAREY>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Percy's writing was topical so it suits the teaching of
> him to use topical media as a supplement - but these young
> students aren't going to get it. Sometimes I think college
> literature is just too advanced for college aged students
> - teenagers or barely out of teenager-dom. I taught a
> World Literature course this summer to a gaggle of
> adorable young sorority girls who dutifully took notes on
> everything we discussed and went over, but I still
> realized that most of the references, allusions, and
> innuendos were lost on them as they would have been on me
> at their age.
>
> The problem is that topical media (music especially) of
> today is so pre-packaged and marketed it has lost the
> artistry and soul and doesn't work in a literature class.
> My 19 year old daughter who is English/art/philosophy
> oriented listens more to the music of 60s and 70s (Bob
> Dylan, Cat Stevens) than what passes for music today. The
> music of today that she considers worth listening to is
> "indy" music, but she says most people her age don't
> listen to it.
>
>
> KP
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of
> Beck, David A Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 11:57 PM
> To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "American Dream"
>
> Larry, Jim et al,
> I think that you are both correct. University presses
> aren't producing Dan Brown-like bestsellers. My hunch is
> that the reason the books are so high (besides the legit
> reasons Larry gave) is that they expect libraries to be
> their main customers. Hence they can gouge libraries and
> forget the mass market. The upside of all of this is that
> the amazon market place offers most of these books at a
> reasonable price. My academic mentor in grad school (the
> late Tony Sherrill) published a great book that also
> discussed Percy (Road-Book America). It had a similiar
> price, but I found it in the used marketplace of amazon
> for half-price (and it looked like it had never been
> opened). The problem, of course, is that the author
> probably won't receive any royalties. But, if you are
> like me and just want the book to be read, the internet
> offers some great deals. I receive such a small commission
> on my books that I'd rather give them away to more people
> than receive the chump change I get for each book sold.
> I wrote two obscure (small press) books on Eastern
> Orthodoxy a decade or so ago. I'm amazed to see that some
> book sellers are offering each book at $40 or more. If
> someone goes via the publisher s/he can get each book for
> under $12 (paperback). Anyway, I am going to ask our
> university library to purchase the book, if they haven't
> already ordered it. Looks good and I look forward to
> reading it. BTW, as a follow up to the last discussion I
> brought up (on The Moviegoer), I'll dive into that book
> next week. I plan to give a big intro, using some of the
> work that Karey and Rhonda provided me. I'll have to
> admit, however, that I am still a little hesitant. Today
> we concluded our poetry section. I thought that it would
> be cool to use some song lyrics. I chose Springsteen's
> "Thunder Road", Counting Crows' "Round Here" and Jakob
> Dylan's (the Wallflowers), "One Headlight." 2/3rds of my
> students weren't familiar enough with Springsteen to be
> able to name ONE song he wrote/sung. They thought that
> Counting Crows were from "my" generation (I'm 47!!!).
> I felt so old that I thought I'd should ask for a handicap
> parking sticker. I mean, I asked, didn't you guys ever
> "roll down the windows and let the wind blow back your
> hair"?? If Springsteen is so dated, how will they get
> Bill Holden and Rory Calhoun?? Sorry, I won't go on, in
> fear that no one here will get it either. Feeling old in
> Indy ("I shall wear the bottoms of my trousers
> rolled"--no, wait, "I shall wear my trousers sagging").
> Time to go to bed (no mermaids sing to me). -David
>
>
>
> Quoting Lawrence Rhu <rhul AT gwm.sc.edu>:
>
> > Jim--
> >
> > Pity indeed. I take your point without any comfort to
> > offer. The crisis in humanities publishing continues,
> > and university presses have had to take drastic measures
> > to survive. Of course, these include such prohibitively
> > high prices, more limited printings, fewer paperbacks at
> > least vaguely in the purchasable range, etc. Still, I
> am pleased that you express some interest. Thanks. >
> > Larry
> >
> > Lawrence F. Rhu
> > Associate Professor of English and Comparative
> > Literature University of South Carolina
> > Columbia, SC 29208
> > Tel: 803 777 0144
> > Fax: 803 777 9064
> > Email: rhul AT sc.edu
> >
> >>>> JHForest AT cs.com 07/04/06 6:13 AM >>>
> >>> The pleasure and satisfaction of having a new book
> > just out have irresistibly combined with the easy
> > availability of an appropriate listserv and a "hard
> > url" to make advertising its recent publication almost
> effortless. As you may
> > recall, I have previously mentioned the presence of
> Percy and especially The
> > Movigoer in my book as a matter of possible interest for
> subscribers to this
> > list. So here it is, just a click away (with my sincere
> > apologies for the price). <<
> >>>
>
http://www.cas.sc.edu/engl/faculty/faculty_pages/rhu/cavell.html
> >
> > What a fine title and inviting cover! But what a pity
> that it costs so much.
> > I fear this will put it beyond the budget of many who
> > might have wished to buy
> > a copy, myself included.
> >
> > Jim Forest
> >
> > * * *
> > Jim and Nancy Forest
> > Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
> > tel: (31)(72) 511 2545
> > Jim's e-mail: jhforest AT cs.com (alternative address:
> > jhforest AT gmail.com) Nancy's e-mail: forestflier AT cs.com
> > (alternative address: forestflier AT gmail.com)
> > Jim and Nancy Forest web site:
> > www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ Forest-Flier Editorial
> > Services: www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ffes/ Jim's
> > photo web site: www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
> > Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: www.incommunion.org
> * * * >
> > --
> > An archive of all list discussion is available at
> > https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
> >
> > Visit the Walker Percy Project at
> http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy >
>
>
>
> --
> An archive of all list discussion is available at
> https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
>
> Visit the Walker Percy Project at
> http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 03:44:06 EDT
> From: JHForest AT cs.com
> Subject: Re: [percy-l] "American Dream"
> To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID: <389.70a0e63.31de1946 AT cs.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> In a message dated 7/6/2006 5:56:52 AM Romance Daylight
> Time, dabeck AT iupui.edu writes:
>
> > I think that you are both correct. University presses
> > aren't producing Dan Brown-like bestsellers. My hunch
> > is that the reason the books are so high (besides the
> > legit reasons Larry gave) is that they expect libraries
> to be their main customers. Hence they can gouge libraries
> > and forget the mass market.
>
> With libraries in mind, I forwarded the URL
>
>
http://www.cas.sc.edu/engl/faculty/faculty_pages/rhu/cavell.html
>
> to my son, Dan, who teaches film studies at the University
> of Amsterdam. I think he'll arrange with the university
> library to get a copy. (Given his interest in the book's
> focus, he may even throw caution to the winds and get a
> personal copy.)
>
> Jim
>
> * * *
> Jim and Nancy Forest
> Kanisstraat 5 / 1811 GJ Alkmaar / The Netherlands
> tel: (31)(72) 511 2545
> Jim's e-mail: jhforest AT cs.com (alternative address:
> jhforest AT gmail.com) Nancy's e-mail: forestflier AT cs.com
> (alternative address: forestflier AT gmail.com)
> Jim and Nancy Forest web site:
> www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ Forest-Flier Editorial
> Services: www.incommunion.org/forest-flier/ffes/ Jim's
> photo web site: www.flickr.com/photos/jimforest/sets/
> Orthodox Peace Fellowship web site: www.incommunion.org *
> * * -------------- next part --------------
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>
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> Percy-L mailing list
> Percy-L AT lists.ibiblio.org
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>
>
> End of Percy-L Digest, Vol 39, Issue 3
> **************************************



  • Re: [percy-l] Percy-L Digest, Vol 39, Issue 3, Marcus, 07/06/2006

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