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  • From: Bear K <bear@ursine-design.com>
  • To: pcplantdb@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [pcplantdb] Synth, comments, etc
  • Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2004 17:32:15 -0800

Been lurking recently, hello all again,

2. 3-dimensional representation of search results - if you searched by
multiple characteristics, how would you display this Johns? on an xy
graph? what if there were more than 2 characteristics? which is why
Lawrence and I were suggesting a 3D representation (i.e. a cube) on which
you could see the characteristics you sorted by mapped onto a 3D object.
does this make better sense?

That would require some Python Imaging Library handwork right? Assuming you produced a still GIF image from it. Or at a later date get someone to build a Flash based viewer using Actionscript to provide interactive viewing (or TouchGraph, etc).

It seems that you could also just score your results from the search to create a cumulative rank. Those with high marks on all three go first on down, and just display it as a list (with the rank split into the different columns, this system would theoretically work with any number of variables, and doesn't require a special UI.

These are/should be front-end issues.

3. feature creep, crop-rotation program, and WSF - yes, this may be
feature creep, but it's fun to dream ;)

Also, it seems like given a database that can accept the right queries, that's a functionality that could happen later. It seems that fields regarding pathogen build up in soil, alleopathy etc should be included in the DB schema, which would allow that functionality at some point. It seems like Elaine Ingram of SoilFoodWeb would have a great deal of knowledge in these (microbiological) issue.

On the subject of disease suppression here is a fascinating post from John d'Hondt which points out that
crop rotation for disease suppression may not always be the best plan to follow (especially if
you're a small farmer or market or home gardener and use natural methods - the chemical/conventional farmers
may need to adhere to standard rotational practices):

The message from John D'hondt actually tied in well with a couple of books I've found recently called Return to Resistance, and Self-Organizing Agro-Ecosystems by Raoul A. Robinson (available free online as PDF's from http://sharebooks.ca). It's a recommended book if you don't know of it already. Raoul is a crop scientist, and talks about the difference between "vertical" (modern, single-gene parasite resistance that parasites can evolve around) and "horizontal" resistance (multi-gene resistance, that can't be easily adapted around). Also some history of a variety of crops (potatoes, etc), and the recent obsession with Mendelian breeding, vs "qualitative" breeding. It's all been rather informative. The techniques of D'hondt are very much what Robinson would recommend (save seed, maintain parasite pressure [don't destroy the affected crop] and select seed from crops that are forming resistance).

Chad wrote:
I am in favor of a more generalist approach
and personally think the best way to figure out a crop rotation or a
guild is with an observant human mind that is in touch with the best
info available (hopefully PIW). At the moment I just can't imagine a
computer system I would trust to really generate a guild or crop
rotation.
Making PIW the google of plant info. Greatly speeding research, not just saying:
Based on X, Y, and Z, you should plant A tree, with B overstory, and C vines.

But if say on the page for a single item view of plant info, it had link to "find related plants".
Actually, a set of links to preformed queries "find functional plants of this genus" (ie search current plant genus with rating of 3 or over). "find plants with similar products", "find plants alleopathic to this one". The plant taxonomy could get "linkified" so each level provided a search for plants (families, genus, etc) above it. This kind of system would really allow you to surf though the network of information that is hopefully getting built (like http://del.icio.us in terms of surfablity). These comments are a front-end issue.

I can embrace the concept of relationships because making connections
between information is an important concept, even if I don't currently
have a real clear idea of implement it. If oberservation has
determined following one annual with another is a beneficial
relationship this could be recorded as such and the interconnection
between the two plants could/should be displayed on both plants.

One interesting thought regarding this is:
Say you have a tree which requires X pollinator. Turns out Z plant attracts Y pollinator. Thus you could write X <- is beneficial to -> Z. What's lacking is that Y is the cause of the benefit. Z plant might not grow under your conditions, so you need to search for other plants that attract Y. It seems like it might be important to include Y somehow. Perhaps the easiest right now would be: X is related [because of: Y] to Z, where [because of Y] is just a text string. Later the schema could grow to allow more info on Y to be added, and a script could run through the field to build out the Y entries.

Thanks for your work all.

Cheers,
Bear K
OpenPermaculture.com





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