North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Michael Dossett <phainopepla@yahoo.com>]

As a parallel, there are many perennials that are difficult to grow in 
western Washington and Oregon, simply because it is difficult to manage soil 
moisture during the dormant season.  They are far hardier from a temperature 
standpoint than any temperatures they will ever suffer here, but they don't 
like having wet feet all winter long and tend to be rather short-lived in the 
lowlands west of the mountains as a result.  I'm not saying this is the exact 
case with Apricots, but I wouldn't at all be surprised if it is something 
peculiar to the climate other than temperature.
 
Michael

Michael Dossett
Mission, British Columbia
www.Mdossettphoto.com
phainopepla@yahoo.com



On Tuesday, December 24, 2013 11:14 AM, Alan Haigh <alandhaigh@gmail.com> 
wrote:
  
>Might the problem be specific to Northeast conditions? Humidity or fall
rains? Soil ph or microbiome affecting hardiness? Changes in >autumn
conditions that might affect a tree's ability to achieve full dormancy?

Because hardening off is a process that includes the reduction of water in
the cells, anything that might change a trees ability to do this might
contribute to the problem in the northeast, however it would take a great
deal of research, I think, to sort it out.  I've never kept serious records
on the issue to methodically compare weather conditions on years when
mortality is high to when it is not.  I don't manage enough apricot trees
to justify going to this effort (the data would be relatively
insignificant) and it is not an important enough commercial crop here to
probably spur funding for such research.

However, Rutgers considers the species valuable enough to devote quite a
bit of expense to breeding better, hardier varieties.  I haven't heard of
them doing any research on the specifics of what causes them to be
relatively tender in the East.

My guess is that it does relate to the relative humidity of our climate as
that seems to be the only significant difference from the conditions
experienced by the high desert trees of the interior West.  There is a wide
range of pH in the soils of sites I manage but I use amendments to keep
them between 6.5-7.5.
__________________
nafex mailing list 
nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
aubscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list 
maintenance:
http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/nafex
message archives
http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/nafex
Google message archive search:
site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/nafex [searchstring] 
nafex list mirror sites:
http://groups.google.com/group/nafexlist
https://sites.google.com/site/nafexmailinglist
Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com/
>From Jwlehman@aol.com  Tue Dec 24 18:25:10 2013
Return-Path: <Jwlehman@aol.com>
X-Original-To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
Delivered-To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
Received: by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix, from userid 20217)
        id DE739E9422; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 18:25:10 -0500 (EST)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on 
mailman1.ibiblio.org
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
        DKIM_VALID, HTML_MESSAGE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham 
version=3.3.1
Received: from omr-d03.mx.aol.com (omr-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.109.200])
        by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FB94E8D46
        for <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 18:25:04 -0500 (EST)
Received: from mtaomg-mac01.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-mac01.mx.aol.com
        [172.26.222.207])
        by omr-d03.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 
6818270000084
        for <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 18:25:04 -0500 (EST)
Received: from core-dsc003c.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-dsc003.r1000.mail.aol.com
        [172.29.253.73])
        by mtaomg-mac01.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id
        0C50D38000086
        for <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 18:25:04 -0500 (EST)
From: Jwlehman@aol.com
Full-name: Jwlehman
Message-ID: <6935f.524594b0.3feb71cf@aol.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2013 18:25:03 -0500 (EST)
To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6036
X-Originating-IP: [50.104.209.38]
x-aol-global-disposition: G
x-aol-sid: 3039ac1adecf52ba17d05550
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9
Subject: Re: [nafex] Winter grafting Asian persimmon
X-BeenThere: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
Reply-To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Id: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex.lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/nafex>,
        <mailto:nafex-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/nafex>
List-Post: <mailto:nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sympa@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=HELP>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/nafex>,
        <mailto:nafex-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2013 23:25:11 -0000

In a message dated 12/24/2013 1:38:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
c.s.carnevale@gmail.com writes:

> Jerry, thanks a ton for the offer of a few feet of parafilm, but I think
> I will buy a roll on eBay, where it is reasonably priced.
>
>

Hello Chris,

Good luck and next summer let me know the outcome. What was the eBay price?

Jerry
>From alandhaigh@gmail.com  Wed Dec 25 12:19:46 2013
Return-Path: <alandhaigh@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
Delivered-To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
Received: by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix, from userid 20217)
        id BE239E9A33; Wed, 25 Dec 2013 12:19:46 -0500 (EST)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on 
mailman1.ibiblio.org
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED,
        DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham
        version=3.3.1
Received: from mail-wg0-f48.google.com (mail-wg0-f48.google.com 
[74.125.82.48])
        by lists.ibiblio.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45361E9A2C
        for <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>; Wed, 25 Dec 2013 12:19:40 -0500 (EST)
Received: by mail-wg0-f48.google.com with SMTP id z12so6783666wgg.27
        for <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>; Wed, 25 Dec 2013 09:19:40 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.194.90.41 with SMTP id bt9mr73888wjb.90.1387991980058; Wed,
        25 Dec 2013 09:19:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.227.193.139 with HTTP; Wed, 25 Dec 2013 09:19:40 -0800 (PST)
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2013 12:19:40 -0500
Message-ID: 
<CAEGtZJyfqb2Z9xB1K2tyR=RM9Rr88n58XdWbs8Vpr+RMMwDqMg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Alan Haigh <alandhaigh@gmail.com>
To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9
Subject: [nafex] (no subject)
X-BeenThere: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
Reply-To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Id: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex.lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/nafex>,
        <mailto:nafex-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/nafex>
List-Post: <mailto:nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
List-Help: <mailto:sympa@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=HELP>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/nafex>,
        <mailto:nafex-request@lists.ibiblio.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2013 17:19:46 -0000

Too wet of soil going into dormancy is the first thing I'd look at,
although I don't see how wet feet would be a problem during dormancy.  I've
seen plenty of healthy fruit trees that have soggy soils most years well
into the first budding out.  Obviously, in the east the soil is going to
moist for the entire dormant period most every year as we average 3-4"
precip every month whether deciduous plants are pulling it out of the soil
of not.  I've never seen early spring not bring moist soil conditions from
winter precip.

At any rate, I've observed no correlation between mortality and excessively
wet falls or winters and soil texture also is not a contributing factor as
last year trees died in a range of soil textures from very sandy to clay
loam.

>As a parallel, there are many perennials that are difficult to grow in
western Washington and Oregon, simply because it is difficult to >manage
soil moisture during the dormant season.? They are far hardier from a
temperature standpoint than any temperatures they >will ever suffer here,
but they don't like having wet feet all winter long and tend to be rather
short-lived in the lowlands west of the >mountains as a result.? I'm not
saying this is the exact case with Apricots, but I wouldn't at all be
surprised if it is something >peculiar to the climate other than
temperature.
?
Michael