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  • From: "Bill Russell" <shaman@penn.com>
  • To: <nafex@yahoogroups.com>
  • Subject: Re: [nafex] "SURROUND"
  • Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001 09:48:02 -0400

Will SURROUND protect grapevines from Japanese beetles?

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard J. Ossolinski" <osso@acadia.net>
To: <nafex@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 8:06 AM
Subject: Re: [nafex] "SURROUND"


> Probably more than you wanted, but perhaps this will help. Scroll to the
end
> to see the message that elicited this response from John Mosko at
Englehard
> Corp (manufacturers of Surround.)
> Richard
> >
> > Gosh Lee, wish you had given us a call earlier for guidance. Sorry that
> > you had trouble.
> >
> > With any new technology, there are benefits and there are going to be
> > challenges, if the benefits outweigh any problems, the technology will
> > fly. So far we've been very, very lucky with the particle film
technology
> > and problems have been solvable.
> >
> > Lee, if you are up to trying it again, for your case, I suggest maybe a
> > Honeycrisp or Jonagold trial that uses applications starting at petal
fall
> > - and then cut off sprays earlier, or, consider ways to improve the
fruit
> > cleaning. You may try it on your Hawkeye for the fun of it. I explain
> > more below.
> >
> > I'll comment, off the cuff, on the points you brought up...
> >
> > Sunburn - No doubt, Surround WP cuts sunburn damage dramatically,
> > importantly, while increasing or, at least, not reducing
photosynthesis.
> > The hotter and less humid the region, the more potential payback.
Studies
> > and grower results in 1999 and 2000 in hot apple growing regions around
> > the world show at least 50% and up to 60 to 80% reduction in damage.
Even
> > in the coolest of seasons like 1999, severe sunburn damage in WA is
still
> > around 10%. In most years, and on some cultivars, the severe damage
> > approaches 20%, and can be higher. CA damage would be even higher.
> > Surround WP can give a nice investment payback - $60 to 100 worth of
> > Surround WP sprays for sunburn can pay 10 to 20X on sunburn damage
> > reduction (not to mention cutting down on insect damage during the
> > treatment period). About half of current Surround WP commercial use
thus
> > far is for sunburn reduction on apples mostly in the western US and we
> > expect this application to grow sharply based on this season's success.
> >
> > Mixing - We have heard of a handful of growers having problems with
mixing
> > in the powder but the vast majority have no problems at all. The most
> > common reasons are low agitation, weak pump returns, or adding the
powder
> > too fast. We have a Spray Guide which offers tips. To give guidance,
we'll
> > need to know the specifics of the sprayer.
> >
> > Color - Our data and experience is that color usually improves, i.e.,
> > redder red apples and greener green apples, or at least neutral. I don't
> > know what to make of your experience. Staymans, Empire, and Pink Lady
in
> > particular have been seen to be redder. We don't 'push' the color
> > improvement benefit. To determine predictable color effects you really
> > need to do replicated studies in multiple years, in multiple regions -
then
> > there are all the cultivars. This is very costly and time-consuming
> > research, obviously.
> > We learned in 'Empire' studies that color improvement is linked to
> > applications made from petal fall to about the 5th or 6th cover.
> > Curiously, this immediate post-petal fall period coverage is crucial for
> > color improvement with Surround WP.
> >
> > Washing - Yeh, can't win right? Some say it washes off the trees too
> > easily and then there's the post-harvest washing issue.
> >
> > Here's the skinny on Surround WP washing off:
> >
> > Surround had a limited launch in 1999 and Surround WP became fully
> > commercial in 2000 and we've already treated a heck of a lot of apples,
> > pears, and lemons (over 60,000 acre treatments in 2000). At least 50
> > packing lines have handled it and yes, especially in 1999, a few of the
50
> > had problems. Most of the problems have been worked out based on our
> > advice and I've heard next to no complaints in 2000 (a few packing
houses
> > with short lines did not take Surround-treated fruit because they feel
that
> > they can't clean it at present).
> >
> > Packing lines with sufficient brush beds, a dump tank in which to add
> > optional fruit washing detergent, and, best of all, high pressure
washing
> > have no problems at all. Fruit wax, if you use it, makes any faint haze
> > invisible.
> >
> > Based on the economic benefits like the one mentioned above in sunburn,
or
> > the dramatic increase in yield for organic growers, an economical
retro-fit
> > of high pressure sprays would be very easily justified. Our standard
> > literature packet has a Fruit Washing Guide that is loaded with tips on
> > fruit washing. Get one at www.surround.engelhard.com
> >
> > If you don't wash at all you can apply from petal fall and go until
about
> > the 4th to 6th cover, then you'll have to stop. This early-only program
> > cuts 1st generation codling moth and early plum curculio damage and also
> > may lead to better color - see color comments above.
> >
> > By the way, traces of Surround WP are not a problem health wise.
Surround
> > WP is composed of ingredients used in food and it is considered to be
> > "exempt from requirements of a tolerance for residues." So Surround WP
> > residues on processing apples are not at issue.
> >
> > Consumers - Clearly, you want to sell clean fruit without a white
> > appearance to consumers and successful washing, or cutting off late
season
> > sprays hopefully will take care of that.
> > I have seen growers turn the white orchard treatments into a positive.
To
> > aid growers and packers in explaining this new product, we have a
> > newly-available consumer-oriented flyer called "Why are the crops
white?"
> > It explains, in a non-technical way, the benefits to growers and
comments
> > favorably on basic safety and environment questions. It can also be
> > requested on www.surround.engelhard.com
> >
> > While I'm at it, a few updates:
> >
> > Plum Curculio - Is Surround WP a solution for organic plum curculio
> > management? There's no doubt that Surround WP has a strong
ovipositional
> > deterrent effect on PC and we've labeled it for 'suppression." The key
is
> > to build a coating onto the young fruitlet and reapply if it is
unusually
> > rainy.
> > Here's what we've seen in 2000 trials: In MI, NY, and New England this
> > season was extremely rainy right around petal fall. Some locations in
NY
> > had precipitation, I believe, 10 straight days around petal fall. Light
> > rains are not as much a problem but if the applications were not
> > supplemented after heavy rains, efficacy dropped off from 1999 results
> > (interestingly, other pesticide efficacy dropped off as well in one
study).
> > Growers that kept the coating on had very good suppresion. Another
grower
> > observed that the coverage must be maintained through the entire
> > ovipositional period; and this is true. A grower said that applications
> > late in the bloom period seemed to keep the PC out of the orchard even
> > before fruit set.
> >
> > What about rainfastness? We had to design Surround WP so that it is
> > reasonably rainfast while being friable enough to cling to insects and
> > removable at harvest. This was a tough challenge.
> > Surround protection is more residual that many think. In a rainy
season,
> > true, reapplications are necessary and 2000 was easily a worst case
basis.
> > In dry periods it lasts indefinitely, and efficacy on such pests as
> > Japanese beetle appear to last far past the point where there is a
highly
> > visible film.
> > A few points:
> > Firstly, resist the temptation to add a sticker, this may cause more
> > problems and reduce insect efficacy.
> > Applications on the young fruitlets haven't developed yet into a
rainfast
> > film, hence the need for reapplication.
> > Applications made in the month after petal fall are more apt to be
lasting.
> > Applications that begin in mid-summer don't generally adhere as well.
So
> > if applying for apple maggot, it would be better to start earlier rather
> > than begin just before AM emergence.
> > Growers are observing that lime-sulfur and wettable sulfur increase
> > adhesion.
> >
> > Lep Control - In general, I'd like to make it clear that leps are only
> > partly suppressed. It has been observed that the first generations of
> > codling moth and oriental fruit moth are significantly suppressed by
> > Surround, but the second and "suicide" generation are not. Some
attribute
> > this to the egg laying habits of moths, i.e., the first generation lands
> > near the fruit and get gummed up as it proceeds to the fruit. The later
> > generations appear to land directly on the fruit, often near the calex
and
> > sting where Surround is less likely to be present. All in all, more or
> > less 50% reduction of damage can be attained in a seasonal program.
> > Supplements are necessary.
> >
> > Off Topic - Pears - For pear psylla, a successful control program starts
> > with dormant oil, then use Surround WP for two to three pre-bloom
sprays,
> > again at PF, and continue with covers. If washing is at issue, simply
> > switch to a different control after the second or third cover.
> > Surround WP works as well or better, frankly, than anything else out
there
> > for pear psylla and has great economics compared to other programs.
This
> > is another solid commercial success for Surround WP.
> > Rainfastness on pears, by the way, is much better than apple. Adhesion
on
> > pear is better and the psylla nymphs inhabit the leaf undersides where
> > Surround doesn't wash off as easily. Psylla studies in the rainy 2000
> > season in the eastern US still showed control.
> >
> > Research in Progress - Diseases - Surround WP, by itself, is not
> > efficacious on many diseases but new data suggests another possible
value
> > of Surround. A replicated study on 'Delicious' done in WV shows marked
> > improvement of fungus control with sulfur compounds when tankmixed with
> > Surround WP. Scab, powdery mildew, sooty blotch, and flyspeck control
were
> > all significantly improved in this experiment that used 1/2 gallon of
> > lime-sulfur (calcium polysulfide liquid) and 4 lbs of wettable sulfur
per
> > 50 lbs of Surround WP in 100 gallons of water.
> >
> > 2000 Insect Data - Extension data is showing excellent control of apple
> > maggot, Japanese beetle, lachynobia, and Rose Chafer with Surround WP.
> >
> > Research in Progress - Honeycrisp - In theory, I say in theory, Surround
> > can be a benefit to this wonderfully crunchy but sometimes troublesome
> > cultivar. Honeycrisp likes a cool climate and Surround will keep the
tree
> > cooler while thwarting leafhoppers and Japanese beetle. We will be
> > studying this further to determine if Surround WP can benefit this
cultivar
> > and what timings/rates would be needed to accomplish this.
> >
> > Before using Surround products, I would suggest reading through our
Guides,
> > in essence this barrier-effect concept seems simple, but for best usage,
> > there are key tips that you'll need to know.
> >
> > John Mosko
> > Surround Crop Protectants
> > Engelhard Corporation
> >
> > applehilorchard@webtv.net (Lee Elliott)@virtualorchard.net> on
11/02/2000
> > 07:48:32 AM
> >
> > Please respond to "Apple-Crop" <apple-crop@virtualorchard.net>
> >
> > Sent by: <apple-crop@virtualorchard.net>
> >
> > To: apple-crop@virtualorchard.net (Apple-Crop)
> > cc:
> > Subject: Apple-Crop: Re: Surround Trial
> >
> > This season I used Surround on a trial basis on 20 Honeycrisp , Galas,
> > and Jonagold trees. It aparently reduced sunburn on all. However, it
> > has it's own problems. This stuff is VERY hard to get mixed up in the
> > sprayer and kept clogging the agitator. Fruit did'nt color up well
> > compared to unsprayed trees, but the biggest problem (the killer) is
> > that the stuff won't wash off well in the packing line. A film of
> > material in the stem cavity won't wash out, making the apple look like
> > a fungus is down in the stem cavity, Bad enough customers don't want
> > these apples. Some remarked that they thought it might be chemical
> > residue and passed these over. It doesn't wash off in rain either,
> > contrary to what some have said. If someone can figure out how to get
> > this product out of the stem cavity they may be on to something. I
> > doubt I will use it again.
> >
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>


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