livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Healthy soil and sustainable growing
List archive
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??
- From: "John D'hondt" <dhondt@eircom.net>
- To: "Healthy soil and sustainable growing" <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
- Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??
- Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 21:41:07 -0000
That is a strange question to me Mitch. Just from
my own experience I can say that there are many trees that do very poorly under my soil and climate conditions. I am
thinking especially about hard fruit like apples , pears and plums. They don't
like our wind at 800 feet above sea level too much.
Another thing that I do know for a fact is that even a small dose of
ammoniacal N kills an apple tree here faster than anything else.
Some trees do very well here though and our
probably best and fastest growing hardwoods are the ash, willows, the
alders (especially the red) and Japanese walnuts.
The alders live in symbiosis with a root nodule
forming soil bacterium "Frankia" that suplies it with air nitrogen but the
others have no root nodules and grow as fast. Obviously they get it from the air
thanks to the metabolism of bacteria for they are getting none from me. The only
thing I have ever given these trees (mostly planted for shelter in poor ground)
was some saw dust or wood shavings from Sitka spruce when I had too much of the
stuff to use in the stables as bedding and I did not need it for weed supression
in the garden.
It is often said that this material robs nitrogen
from plants and makes for poor crops of vegetables but I have never seen this
happen probably because I have always left it on the surface and never dug it
in. When we first started here 25 years ago that would have been completely
impossible. I broke pick axes here without making much of an impression on the
rocky ground.
But the saw dust broke down into nice friable soil
(more than 2 feet deep after 25 years) which must mean that bacteria and fungi
used it as an energy source while converting N2 gas in the air to useful N. It
could have come from nowhere else.
I can not put a name on these microbes and I am not
in the least interested myself what name they go by or if they have already all
been named. I am sure there are more than a few different ones.
The reason I am not interested in such trivia is
that I expect some bad shit to hit the fan quite soon and I am busy with other
things (such as trying to overcome apple bark cancer)
I spend 2-3 years cultivating a microbe that
eats Phytophtra infestans (Irish potato blight) and I have been growing potatoes
for almost 25 years without spraying anything. With no blight damage whatsoever
in the last 20. This in Ireland where many professional potato farmers see their
crop rot to slime quite regularly while spraying expensive and highly toxic
pesticides at least once a week against blight.
I have explained in the past on several listst how
to get the same results against blight as I have here but I am afraid that it
did not much good. Very few people are prepared to work at it for 2-3 years
while seeing a crop rot in the first few years. Most would like to buy a
proprietary culture of anti- blight microbes. And if I had ten years of my
life to waste at this I am sure that I could come up with a commercial
solution. I simply don't have that time.
Now to come back to your question : You should know
what sort of trees grow well in your area. Those are the ones I would go for and
you may find you do not need to pamper them to do well.
Ammoniacal N is produced from valuable nitrogen
holding molecules like protein under anaerobic conditions. I would advice
strongly not to aim for that. Anaerobic fermentation stinks and causes most of
the N to get lost. That is one golden rule to always remember : if your
compost/manure heap smells bad something is very wrong. You should never
encourage that.
john
OK, now that you've revealed that you're not a "dumb farmer" ;-) I've got a related question: What (microbes?) produce ammoniacal N, that trees most prefer, and how do I encourage them? |
-
Re: [Livingontheland] the learning curve - charcoal
, (continued)
- Re: [Livingontheland] the learning curve - charcoal, John D'hondt, 12/16/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] the learning curve - charcoal, Marty Kraft, 12/17/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] the learning curve - charcoal, John D'hondt, 12/20/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing,
richard green, 12/07/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??,
Debbie McDonald, 12/08/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??, Charles, 12/08/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??,
richard green, 12/09/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??,
John D'hondt, 12/13/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??, Emery Mitchamore, 12/14/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??, John D'hondt, 12/16/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??, Emery Mitchamore, 12/16/2010
- Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??, John D'hondt, 12/20/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??,
John D'hondt, 12/13/2010
-
Re: [Livingontheland] Charcoal Crushing/inoculate the charcoal??,
Debbie McDonald, 12/08/2010
Archive powered by MHonArc 2.6.24.