Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Nir cohen - Prof. Mat." <nir AT ccet.ufrn.br>]

david,

i am amazed at the rate at which i am forgetting my mother tongue. 
lack of use, i suppose.

of course below i was referring to DARDAR, not DORBAN. although the
two might be related, and may fit the description, dardar really refers, in  
hebrew, to thorny plants, not dorban.

and the correct expression is kotzin vedardarim...

 can anybody verify if SMR or DORBAN or DARDAR are BH?

see also NA'ATzUTz isa55:13.

nir cohen

 SHAMIR: it makes sense to suggest shamir for brier or similar thorny-head 
plants in the region, some possibly extinct by now. but there are two 
problems: 1) the s-->sh transformation. as it happens, SMR for thorny is used 
in modern hebrew in several ways (samar se'ar rosho, masmer, samur) and none 
of them with sh. (see below for s<-->sh).2) another possible candidate for 
brier would be dorban used in the expression"kotzim vedorbanot." also the 
name for porcupine and for anyinstrument of the same quality used on animals. 
see the (talmudic?) expression"dvarim ke-dorvanot". can anybody verify if SMR 
or DORBAN are BH?--------------SHAIT: maybe related with ShTT, i.e. a plant 
which causes one'sskin to bleed. it might even be the case that "shamir 
va-shait" is an inseparable idiomatic pair (similar to "shod va-shever") 
simply characterizing a whole family of plants which are BOTH thorny  (shape) 
and brewsing (function). see also "kotzim ve-dorbanot" or "shotim ve-akrabi
 m", also used as complete pairs.

2) another possible candidate for brier would be dorban used in the 
expression"kotzim vedorbanot." also the name for porcupine and for 
anyinstrument of the same quality used on animals. see the (talmudic?) 
expression"dvarim ke-dorvanot".