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  • From: "Arnaud Fournet" <fournet.arnaud AT wanadoo.fr>
  • To: <if AT math.bu.edu>, <jimstinehart AT aol.com>
  • Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Vav Nun Suffix
  • Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 12:09:46 +0100


----- Original Message ----- From: jimstinehart AT aol.com
To: fournet.arnaud AT wanadoo.fr ; if AT math.bu.edu
Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2010 5:12 AM
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Vav Nun Suffix



Dr. Fournet:

You wrote: “All this is nonsense in the first place. Who can believe that a Semitic name could be suffixed by the grammatical morphemes of another language?”

Leah names all 6 of her blood sons. Leah is portrayed in the text as living exclusively in Naharim until middle age. Wouldn’t it make sense if 2 of those 6 names are west Semitic names with a non-Semitic-sounding final element? The vav nun/-WN/-we-ni- ending of the names of Leah’s blood son #2 and blood son #6 are, in my opinion, purposely designed to “sound non-Semitic”. Many of the proper names in the famous non-Semitic letter on your website, which in my view was written only 3 years before the Patriarchal narratives were composed, feature long suffixes with the -we-ni- suffix sequence element. That’s vav nun/-WN in Biblical Hebrew.
***
This "non-Semitic" thing is a descriptive fallacy. There's no such dichotomy in the real world.

I don't think the Patriarchal narratives were "composed" at a precise time. This is basically a living memory of genealogical relationships. Of course at one point this living memory was put on the paper and we now have it.
A.
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If the names of those two sons of Leah contained that vav in the Late Bronze Age (which I believe they did), then that vav way back then would have been pronounced by the early Hebrews something like “we”, because back then a vav was a true consonant. The following nun then would likely have been pronounced something like “ni”, being two true consonants back to back, creating two syllables. So the original pronunciation of the name of Leah’s #2 son would likely have been something like $ima-WE-NI. And at p. 23 of your website you have Mi-zi- ir- ri- e- WE-NI-eš; and the name of Leah’s #6 son would have been pronounced something like Zebelu-WE-NI, and at p. 23 you have Ši-mi-i- gi- ni- e- WE-NI- e-ma-a-an, and Zebulun named one of his own sons Al-WE-NI at Genesis 46: 14, and at p. 24 you have d Ši- mi- i- gi- ni- e-WE- NI- e- im- ma- ma- an; and Levi, another son born in Naharim and named by his mother Leah, names one of his sons Gara$a-WE-NI, and back at p. 23 again you have at- ta- a- ar- ti- i- WE- NA-a- ma-a-an, and Genesis 26: 34 has Ayali-WE-NI, but that non-Semitic letter from the same time period never lets up, as at p. 24 you report še-e-ni- ib-[WU]- ú- e-NI- e- wə, though the Bible can counter with Ssibaiya-WE-NI at Genesis 36: 2, yet that short portion of that famous non-Semitic letter on your website is not done yet, as you report at p. 24 ti- WE- e- NA, though perhaps the Bible manages to have the last word with Epiri-WE-NI at Genesis 23: 8. What your website reports is what Leah heard from birth to middle age. So why doesn’t it make sense for Leah to give two of her sons in Naharim in eastern Syria names whose ending recalled the hundreds of -WE-NI- suffix sequences she had heard her non-Semitic neighbors saying every day of her life until she finally left Naharim and moved to Canaan? That letter on your website is what Leah heard from her neighbors every day of her life, isn’t it?
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Could you just accept that -we-ni is grammatical material: genitive case -we- plus article -ni-?
I think you reason too much by "proof by contamination": you find something which vaguely sounds like something else and then transfer the properties of one thing to the other and constantly move on from one thing to another applying that "method".
A.
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If you insist that the vav nun endings of $M(-WN and ZBL-WN have no non-Semitic connection, then please set forth your own view as to an all-west Semitic analysis of the vav nun suffix in those two names. It seems unlikely to me that a 1st millennium BCE editor would have jammed vavs into those two ancient names. But if that is not your theory of the case, then what is your theory of the case? Vowels were not recorded in early Biblical Hebrew. Certainly the name $M(-WN in particular is a truly ancient name. Where did the interior vav come from in that name? I myself cannot even find a published scholarly theory as to where that interior vav came from. Do you know of one? Other than ultra-generic statements that plene-type spelling appears throughout the Bible, I have not been able to find any scholarly explanation of why there’s an interior vav in the ancient name $M(-WN. How did that vav get there, and when, and why, and by whom? Either the scholarly theory is that a 1st millennium BCE editor took it upon himself to update the spelling of that ancient name [though I have never seen a published statement to that effect as to this name, so maybe that in fact is not the scholarly theory of the case], or else, as far as I can tell, no scholar has ever opined what that interior vav is doing in the name Simeon.

What’s your theory of the case? You’re quick to characterize my theory as being “nonsense”, but that implies that there’s a more convincing theory of the case out there. What would that be?
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I'm not a competent philologist on Hebrew and I have no theory.
I'm not even sure there is an issue at all with -w- in those names.
In all cases I would first try to explain these names with internal i.e Semitic material.

In all cases rejecting your misuse of Hurrian material is one thing and it does not create the burden of an alternative theory.
A.
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The whole point of this thread is to explore the vav nun suffix in Biblical Hebrew. If I’m barking up the wrong tree in my proposed non-Semitic analysis of the vav nun suffix, then why don’t you or someone else set forth a better, more convincing theory of the case? I’m all ears.

My own theory of the case is that (i) the vav nun suffix was there in the name $M(-WN from day #1, and has nothing whatsoever to do with plene spelling issues, but rather dates all the long way back to the Late Bronze Age, and (ii) the explicit purpose of that vav nun/-WN/-we-ni- suffix was precisely to give the name of Leah’s #2 son a “non-Semitic sound”. On my view, it’s not a “coincidence” that the name Simeon ends with -we-ni, and that so many names in that famous non-Semitic letter you cite on your website similarly include in their long suffixes the component -we-ni- [or some close variant thereof].

In your opinion, why is there a vav in the name of Jacob’s son #2?
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Why not?
I don't understand why this should an issue.
שִׁמְעֹון
Apparently that name should logically be accented on the last vowel as the rest is short -i- and schwa, so it's in my humble opinion unsurprising that the last vowel is long and therefore rendered with -w-.
I would reconstruct *S_m_(oon with two initial "void" slots. I'll let competent Semiticists give their PoV.

Arnaud Fournet





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