Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Peter Kirk"<peter_kirk AT sil.org>]

I think part of the confusion here is that you have not fully taken 
into account the difficult syntax of Ezra 9:1. There is an exegetical 
question: were the speakers actually saying that the peoples of the 
lands ARE Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites etc, or were they saying 
that the contemporary peoples of the lands are just as detestable in 
their practices as these ancient bywords of detestation? Note the k- 
in the Hebrew:

.. mE(ammEy hA):arAcOwt K:tOw(:abOtEyhem lakk:na(:anIy ...

NRSV: "...from the peoples of the lands with their abominations, from 
the Canaanites..."

NIV: "...from the neighbouring peoples with their detestable 
practices, like those of the Canaanites..."

But which interpretation is right? From the context we can say that 
the NRSV is unlikely (in a literal sense), for, as Michael has said, 
as many of these peoples just do not seem to have been around in the 
Persian period, the names are rather memories from a much earlier 
period. But I doubt if the Hebrew demands to be translated like the 
NRSV rather than the NIV.

We need to settle this exegetical issue before trying to use this 
verse in arguments for dating.

Peter Kirk


______________________________ Reply Separator 
_________________________________
Subject: Dating the Pentateuch- Genesis and Ezra
Author:  <mattfeld AT mail.pjsnet.com> at Internet
Date:    13/03/2000 07:22


In a recent post to this list (14 Feb. 2000) Professor Jonathan D. Safren 
noted that the Jewish Humanist scholar Spinoza (ca. 1670 CE) suspected that 
Ezra had written the Torah:

"Spinoza's idea that Ezra wrote the Torah is still a pretty good guess (but 
only that)."

If Ezra wrote the "Primary History" (Genesis-2 Kings), then it is most 
unlikely that he would have written the statement found in Ge. 13:7, 
describing the historical situation in the days of Abraham and Lot-

"At that time the Canaanites and the Perizzites dwelt in the Land"

This statement suggests to some commentators that the narrator is explaining 
to his audience a situation that currently doesn't prevail, i.e., there are 
no Canaanites or Perizzites presently in the land.

That Ezra would not have written this is suggested by comments attributed to 
him in Ezr.9:1-

"The people of Israel...have not separated themselves from the peoples of 
the lands...from the CANAANITES, the Hittites, the PERIZZITES, the 
Jebusites, the Ammonites..."

How many years must elapse after Ezra's arrival in Jerusalem (ca. 458 BCE 
according to some schools of thought), such that the national conscience 
would have no memory of Canaanites and Perizzites having dwelt in the land- 
100 or 200 yrs perhaps for the memory banks to have become erased, 
warranting such a statement as Ge. 13:7 ?

This anomaly would suggest that Ge. 13:7 is perhaps a late gloss of either 
the Late Persian or perhaps even Hellenistic periods, the 4th-3rd centuries 
BCE.

All the best,

Walter

Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld
Walldorf by Heidelberg
Baden-Wurttemburg
Germany