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  • From: "Peter Kirk"<peter_kirk AT sil.org>
  • To: <b-hebrew AT franklin.oit.unc.edu>
  • Subject: Re[2]: SV: Gilgamesh (Jonathan)
  • Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 00:52:54 -0500


Jonathan, you don't need to use that tone. You have failed to deal
with Ian's point (which he may have got from me) that Genesis 11:31
indicates that Haran is a long way from Ur Kasdim, not just that both
are a long way from Canaan.

As for names that look like Nahor, if there are three in upper
Mesopotamia, how many were there further south? And how many whose
names have now been lost? There are no doubt plenty of them wherever
there are rivers all over the Middle East including in southern
Mesopotamia, as the root N-H-R means "river" in Arabic as well as
Hebrew. Now I know the name Nahor is spelt with a het. Are your
alleged identifications spelt with a het or its equivalent?

Peter Kirk

PS This list is not the place for virus alerts. Although this one may
be genuine, many are hoaxes, and much bandwidth is wasted by
unnecessary copying of such alerts. Please keep to the subject on this
list.


______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Re: SV: Gilgamesh (Jonathan)
Author: <yonsaf AT beitberl.beitberl.ac.il> at Internet
Date: 19/01/2000 19:50


Ian Hutchesson wrote:
I don't think this theory is actually dealing with the text, Jonathan. We

> are told that Abraham was to set off from Ur of the Chaldeans and go to the
> land of Canaan, but when he came to Haran, they settled there. The
> narrative is written ot indicate that Ur was a long way from Haran, which
> is in line with the Ur that we all know and not some northern Ur which may
> have been known to the writer. The first part of the chapter (11) is set in
> southern Mesopotamia.

You are most definitely right that the text is written to indicate that Ur
-
and
Harran - are a long way off from Canaan.
But remember, they didn't fly in jet planes in those days. Upper
mesopotamia,
for
the writer's purposes, was the same as Southern Mesopotamia - a long, long
way o
ff.
And the fact that the first part of the chapter is set in Southern
Mesopotami
a
doesn't mean a thing. The last part of the chapter mentions Serug = Serugi
near
the
Balih Valley; 2 Nahors=Nahur on the Upper Habur or Til Nahiri on the Balih or
Ni
hriya,
also in Upper Mesopotamia; and Terah = Til Turahi, in the Balih River Valley.
No, Ian, you can't get around it, you'll have to leave off that old-fashioned
th
eory
identifying Ur Kasdim with Sumerian Ur, which has nothing to support it but
the
similarity of the names - and THERE WERE OTHER CITIES NAMED UR!!! (Which is
why
the
author affixes the denominative Kasdim).
I think I've marshalled enough evidence, both on this list and on the ANE
list
, both
from the Bible and from the ANE, in favor of a northern location, so please
let'
s stop
wasting bandwidth and boring people with unnecessary rehashing. Let's simply
agr
ee to
disagree, as is done in scholarly and other circles.
And if you really think it necessary, I can always repost those letters.
Prof. L
emche
agrees.
Sincerely,--
Jonathan D. Safren
Dept. of Biblical Studies
Beit Berl College
44905 Beit Berl Post Office
Israel






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