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  • From: George Sherwood <pilot AT beernabeer.com>
  • To: sm-discuss AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [SM-Discuss] GNOME 3
  • Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 09:27:43 -0500

On Fri, 13 May 2011 12:02:25 -0700
Eric Sandall <eric AT sandall.us> wrote:

> On Wed, 2011-04-27 at 10:39 -0700, Eric Sandall wrote:
> > On Tue, 2011-04-26 at 01:58 +0200, Ladislav Hagara wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > imho, GNOME 3 is prepared to be pulled into test grimoire.
> > > Now it is located in devel-gnome-3.0.0 branch [1].
> > > Please test it.
> > >
> > > Still there is a question what to do with libs and applications. I
> > > updated for example epiphany, evince or even eog2 in gnome2-libs
> > > and gnome2-apps into 3.0.0. Some developers would prefer to
> > > create new spells epiphany3, evince3 and eog3 and create
> > > gnome3-apps section. Imho, it is only a lot of useless work.
> > > Grimoire lead is also against creating for example spiphany3
> > > spell. Why use epiphany 2.30 when the stable one is 3.0? If spell
> > > names are not changed users can easily update their boxes by
> > > sorcery system-update and we won't have to deprecated old spells.
> > > Personally I would prefer to have only gnome-apps and gnome-libs
> > > sections. Of course, for applications based on gnome2 libraries
> > > we will provide spells for them. For example I have created
> > > spells for new 3.0 libraries gnome-desktop3, gtksourceview3,
> > > libwnck3 and libunique because some of my favourite applications
> > > still need gnome2-libs. For what other libs we should create
> > > libxxx3 spells and revert libxxx2 in devel-gnome-3.0.0?
> > >
> > > Of course we have to fix DEPENDS files and ..., but I would
> > > prefer to do it after we pull gnome-3.0.0 into test to prevent
> > > collisions.
> > >
> > > Gnome-shell works for me like a charm. Of course there is a
> > > fallback mode with gnome-panel.
> > >
> > > [1]
> > > http://scmweb.sourcemage.org/gitweb.cgi?p=smgl/grimoire.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/devel-gnome-3.0.0
> >
> > My personal preference would be to properly deprecate the older DEs
> > (e.g. KDE 3, GNOME 1.x, GNOME 2.x) in favour of the new (e.g. KDE 4,
> > GNOME 3) if upstream does the same (which they have). Otherwise, we
> > get old stagnant spells which are never touched and probably don't
> > even work anymore. We're supposed to follow upstream as much as
> > possible. ;)
> >
> > That being said, so long as the old DE still works, we could still
> > support it (e.g. GNOME 2.x). Further weight is lent to keeping the
> > older DE when packages still require it, or portions of it.
> >
> > Can GNOME 3.x and GNOME 2.x co-exist? I know KDE 3 and KDE 4 can,
> > but that required extra work (and placing KDE 4 into /opt).
> >
> > Given the above, and that folks have expressed a need (valid to
> > them, at the least) to keep the old DE around, we should work to
> > provide both, preferably with both installed side-by-side, but if
> > that's not possible, then making all new GNOME 3 spells where
> > needed and leaving the GNOME 2 spells as-is.
>
> So this came up again as I reverted some packages which broke older
> GNOME spells (e.g. empathy), but worked with the newer GNOME 3 in
> test. What's the plan? Have the spells in devel-gnome-3-0-0 been done
> so that they can co-exist with gnome2 or would they upgrade gnome2 to
> gnome3 (I believe the latter from what little I've read of the
> changes in that branch)?
>
> Anyone willing to work on having gnome2/gnome3 co-exist? If not, I see
> no valid reason to keep gnome2 around (or the older KDE's for that
> matter) as we try to follow upstream for what's supported.
>

I agree with Eric's position on this. We need to get GNOME 3 integrated
into the test grimoire as we are going to see more and more breakage
if we don't. If we can do it without breaking GNOME 2 that would be
best, but I don't want to wait 6 months hoping that some one will
commit the fix to allow them to co-exist.

George

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