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Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs. monsanto

From: John Fritz <johnfritz77@yahoo.com>
To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs. monsanto
Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 09:28:06 -0800 (PST)

Why? Why is it unrealistic to expect anything to come of it (CGM in place of
RoundUp)? While it appears you would expect a NPSPMDN to be successful both
concepts would be grass roots efforts which have their inherent problems but
I don't see any reason to expect one would be more successul than the other.

David Blume's idea is that CGM as a byproduct of locally produced ethanol
would circumvent Monsanto entirely while eliminating most of the transport
miles. Sounds pretty simple to me.

Though this might gain a lot of worthwhile, possibly long lasting media
attention (if done right with adequate preparation) but otherwise it is
probably unrealistic to expect that anything will come of it.

A far wiser strategy and better use of people's energies is to build a
NPSPMDN: National Product and Services Production, Marketing and
Distribution Network, a giant multifaceted nationwide
barter-swap-purchase-sell-exchange networked cooperativethat relies on
the KIS principle, a system that could be replicated in other countries.

>From johnfritz77@yahoo.com Mon Jan 31 12:40:50 2011
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Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 09:40:46 -0800 (PST)
From: John Fritz <johnfritz77@yahoo.com>
To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
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Subject: Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs monsanto
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O.K., I had not heard about the part where the crops would have to be
pre-sprouted before being planted. That would be tricky. But as far as
asking Monsanto to supply the CGM, I don't think they even have any current
access to it. It would require that they produce ethanol, and to the best of
my understanding that is not something that they are involved in. Maybe
Archer Daniels Midland.

But it is irrelevant. Blume's idea is for the use of CGM as a by-product of
locally produced ethanol which is entirely independent of corporate webs.
If anyone wants to know more, Blume's ideas are much better explained at
http://www.permaculture.com/node/518
www.acbagnetwork.ning.com and www.permaculture.com.

John Fritz, NW Arkansas.

Message: 4
Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 10:21:43 -0600
From: Leslie Moyer <unschooler@lrec.org>
To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs monsanto
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On Jan 30, 2011, at 8:29 AM, John Fritz wrote:

> When applied to soil after tillling and before the crop seed sprouts, CGM
>is a potent herbicide. It does not kill all the so-called pest plants but
>suppresses enough of them (about 80% IIRC) so that the crop seed has a
>chance to sprout, get a head start, and out compete the "weeds" depriving
>those that do survive of their needed sunlight.

Corn gluten meal will suppress ALL seed germination--not just the weed seed,
but the intended crop seed, too, so timing of application has to be just
right to suppress only the germination of the weed seed. For this reason, it
works very well for planting pre-sprouted transplants into a pre-treated soil
bed. It's a little trickier when you're direct-seeding as conventional
farmers would for a large monocrop field. As I understand it, the seed
actually germinates, but does not form a root.

> As a direct market challenge to Monsanto though I see much value in David
> Blume's tactic.

I can see it now....Monsanto *promoting* CGM as an alternative to herbicides.
Corn would, of course, be GMO and treated with Round-Up. :-/

--Leslie / NE Oklahoma

>From venaurafarm@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 31 15:04:05 2011
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Subject: Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs. monsanto
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On 1/31/2011 12:28 PM, John Fritz wrote:
> Why? Why is it unrealistic to expect anything to come of it (CGM in
> place of RoundUp)? While it appears you would expect a NPSPMDN to be

I meant a NPSPMDN instead of "direct action and non-violent civil
disobedience", not "Corn Gluten Meal (CGM) and Dried Distiller's Grains
(DDG)".

> successful both concepts would be grass roots efforts which have
> their inherent problems but I don't see any reason to expect one
> would be more successul than the other.

Apples and oranges. A networked cooperative of learners, volunteers,
buyers and sellers is needed to supplement existing marketing
opportunities especially for those in need, i.e. living on a very
limited budget [as a means to drive a monkeywrench into the works of
those seeking to drive those folks into lower economic status becoming
dependent on welfare aid to survive, while the wealthy class gains
greater economic status and economic and political power as food/goods
production and distribution falls under the control of corporate
agriculture, as opposed to a distributed local system, which has worked
for thousands of years].
What I see looming on the horizon: those who promoted and campaigned for
the food safety modernization act, S.510, without small farmer
exemptions and with GAP will be back trying to get their legislation
passed. This scenario could result in your not having the right to grow
and sell a single leaf of arugula to your neighbor without government
permission.
What this means: we need to establish a grower-producer/consumer
networked exchange system,
locale by locale, region by region until goods can be exchanged across
the country when there
is an opportunity to do so.

> David Blume's idea is that CGM as a byproduct of locally produced
> ethanol would circumvent Monsanto entirely while eliminating most of
> the transport miles. Sounds pretty simple to me.

The keyword is local. CGM & DDG is a hotly traded commodity as it is
used in livestock and pet food. Would they make more money selling it to
farmers for use as herbicide, keeping in mind its preemergent qualities,
probably not.
The only answeris to make your own alcohol fuel locally and use the
byproducts in an appropriate way as herbicide.

Re: [permaculture] corn gluten meal vs. monsanto, John Fritz, 01/31/2011