permaculture

[Dieter Brand <diebrand@yahoo.com>]

Jay,
 
I’m not sure I understand your concept.  If the area behind the dam is filled 
with soil that’s washed down during storms, how then can you use water from 
behind the dam for irrigation?

 
I use stones and fallen over tree trunks to build numerous little dams across 
waterlines so as to trap water and soil that’s washed down during heavy 
rains.  This prevents soil from being washed down into the river and breaks 
the water flow, thus allowing more rain water to enter the soil; however, I 
can’t use it for irrigation.
 
To trap water for irrigation and the household, I excavated a hole in a place 
with humidity all through the year.  I put in a tube at the bottom to draw 
off water by gravity.  Then I used large stones to build dry stone walls 
(well they aren’t really dry, I mean walls without mortar) inside the hole.  
Upstream of the stone-lined hole, I filled in the empty space with stones and 
gravel to allow water to flow into the walled hole and to filter it at the 
same time.  Downstream, I used a type of gray clay (can’t remember the 
English word, argile in French) that is impenetrable to water.  In this way, 
all the water coming down the hill is first filtered and then stored inside 
the stone-lined hole from where I can draw it off into a water tank.
 
Dieter Brand
Portugal

--- On Thu, 8/28/08, Jay Woods <woodsjay@cox.net> wrote:

From: Jay Woods <woodsjay@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Conserving water in ponds
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 9:03 AM

Jay, I’m not sure I understand your concept.  If the area behind the dam is 
filled with soil that’s washed down during storms, how then can you use water 
from behind the dam for irrigation? I use stones and fallen over tree trunks 
to build numerous little dams across waterlines so as to trap water and soil 
that’s washed down during heavy rains.  This prevents soil from being washed 
down into the river and breaks the water flow, thus allowing more rain water 
to enter the soil; however, I can’t use it for irrigation. To trap water for 
irrigation and the household, I excavated a hole in a place with humidity all 
through the year.  I put in a tube at the bottom to draw off water by 
gravity.  Then I used large stones to build dry stone walls (well they aren’t 
really dry, I mean walls without mortar) inside the hole.  Upstream of the 
stone-lined hole, I fill in the empty space with stones and gravel to allow 
water to flow into the walled hole
 and to filter it at the same time.  Downstream, I used a type of gray clay 
(can’t remember the English word, argile in French) that is impenetrable to 
water.  In this way, all the water coming down the hill is first filtered and 
then stored inside the stone-lined hole from where I can draw it off into a 
water tank.  On Wednesday 27 August 2008 03:27:17 pm Dieter Brand wrote:> I 
live in the South of Portugal. > Rainfall May through September:  0 inches. > 
This is not a drought it is the regular dry season. > A drought is when the 
winter rains also fail, which happens on everage > twice every 14 years. > 
Most people around here have artificial lakes.  A bulldozer will close a > 
small valley with a dam and then compact the soil.  In some places the soil > 
holds the water well, in other places the lake bottom leaks so much that it> 
runs dry before the summer is over even without using any water for > 
irrigation.  It's a bit of gamble.  To have
 any effect it needs to be at > least a quarter acre in size.  There is no 
way to prevent evaporation.  The > deeper the lake the better your chances of 
having water all through the > summer. The depth should not be less then 20 
or 30 feet. > I don't have a lake.  I try to increase SOM (soil organic 
matter) so as to > improve the water retention properties of the soil. A clay 
soil with high > organic content has good soil structure and many pores that 
can multiply > the amount of water held by the soil without being water 
logged. In the > garden, I have been able to reduce irrigation by about 80% 
in the last 6 > years.  Weeds and grass are cut at the onset of the dry 
season so as to > reduce transpiration.  The topsoil and mulch prevent 
evaporation through > capillary action.  There isn't much one can do about 
deep percolation > though.  Other strategies include, growing as much as 
possible during the > wet season, and learning which crop will
 survive with little or not water, > for examples: beans, tomatoes, squash, 
etc. > Dieter Brand, Portugal> >  > > --- On Wed, 8/27/08, Robert Waldrop 
<bwaldrop@cox.net> wrote:> > From: Robert Waldrop <bwaldrop@cox.net> > 
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Conserving water in ponds > To: "permaculture" 
<permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2008, 3:08 PM> 
> Other ideas about mitigation strategies would be> helpful too. RMW> > ----- 
Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Waldrop" <bwaldrop@cox.net>> To: 
"permaculture" > <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org> > Sent: Wednesday, August 
27, 2008 9:07 AM > Subject: [permaculture] Conserving water in ponds> > >A 
report has recently been released by the > > Oklahoma Climatological Survey 
predicting that> > as > > a result of climate change, droughts in Oklahoma > 
> will increase in frequency and severity. As a > > result, there is a 
discussion going on among the > > producers-members of the Oklahoma
 Food Coop over > > mitigation strategies. One issue that has come> > up > > 
is "conserving water in ponds", presumably by > > reducing evaporation.> > > 
> Any thoughts about that? Would aquatic plants > > that cover the surface of 
the water help?> > > > Bob Waldrop, 
OKC_______________________________________________ permaculture mailing 
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Pictures, anybody?
I have a small pond, the previous owner used some grey clay they found and 
lined the 5 ft deep pond, the water is clear and blue!, of course in order to 
hold water year round it would have to be a lot deeper, but this small hole 
was dug by hand and lined with clay by hand so in principle it works. The 
grey clay seems be near some of the creeks around Texas hill country, I'm 
gonna look up argile and find out more, meanwhile would you two consider 
pictures or a link to drawings of what you did, I have lots and lots of rocks 
to work with.

Trudie 
512-471-8044


-----Original Message-----
From: permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org 
[mailto:permaculture-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Dieter Brand
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 4:31 PM
To: permaculture
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Conserving water in ponds


Jay,
 
I’m not sure I understand your concept.  If the area behind the dam is filled 
with soil that’s washed down during storms, how then can you use water from 
behind the dam for irrigation?

 
I use stones and fallen over tree trunks to build numerous little dams across 
waterlines so as to trap water and soil that’s washed down during heavy 
rains.  This prevents soil from being washed down into the river and breaks 
the water flow, thus allowing more rain water to enter the soil; however, I 
can’t use it for irrigation.
 
To trap water for irrigation and the household, I excavated a