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permaculture - Re: [permaculture] politics and permies - Ghandi quote

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  • From: KNat <knat@sprintmail.com>
  • To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] politics and permies - Ghandi quote
  • Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2007 06:05:40 -0500

Toby Hemenway wrote:
Few could be persuaded to come administer the colony when their predecessors and their families had been murdered. He makes a similar claim for M.L. King, that violent race riots in Selma and other cities opened the door for King. I don't know what to make of his claims (I have only read reviews of the book, not the book itself). But I am reminded of Derrick Jensen's statement that the reason we have used violence so consistently is because it is so effective. Non-violence can be effective, too--it's just a lot more difficult and we're no where near as good at it.
I often have this dialogue with kids now. It must be reaching qi.
As a child at knee in the early 60s formation of equal rights, I am well aware there were many players and they often worked together. Side jokes of, "Can't we sick [the militants] on this part first then talk to him?" often popped up at strategy meetings (Chicago and NY.)
The question is, which is more powerful, Holding the food supply/livelihood of a man's family or holding a man's family? While the latter seems more direct, the world change is in the view of his child and grandchild. Will they follow their captors or their rescuers? Which can you with good conscience do, feed someone who's made some seriously bad choices or deny another human life? Why? What was the impact to you and your relationships and how is that relevant to the change?
Seems like all are means to the same end but the difference is the view of how big a change do you want to make, A person or a cultural attitude? If the violence is the effective part, why is there still need for it? Changing leaders isn't changing systems. Is non-violence really only growing because the population is growing?

Peace,
Kathyann





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