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  • From: John Schinnerer <eco_living@yahoo.com>
  • To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] Thanks to Permaworld
  • Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 00:02:40 -0700 (PDT)

Aloha,

> You don't have to participate or promote the Permaworld system, but
> there's no need to badmouth and misrepresent a legitimate initiative
> aimed at supporting permaculture on its weakest aspect which is the
> aquiring of funds to further its work.

I agree that fundraising can be a pain. I have friends with various
small organizations doing what I consider to be good work in the world,
and I am always amazed at how they manage to get grants, do
fundraisers, etc. and keep things going. I have no patience for or
interest in doing that sort of thing. I don't do any fundraising
myself, other than working to earn money which (aside from the usual
life essentials like rent, food (some supporting local organic
farmers), etc.) I spend on implementation of my projects, save for
buying land, and even use to support PC by spending some on PC and
related courses, books, magazine subscriptions, etc.

As for MLMs...

I find MLMs I am sufficiently familiar with (CellTech, Melaleuca, Amway
- not exactly short-lived, illegal or marginal operations) to do a
great deal of misrepresenting of their own, using classic, time-tested
and proven 'marketing techniques' (propaganda and psychological
manipulation, to use other terms) that are carefully designed to 'hook'
people into their systems. All the usual of these are readily apparent
on the Permaworld site. So I think my 'misrepresentations' are simply
alternatives to theirs. Call it badmouthing if you wish.

I've never said MLMs were necessarily illegal. I'm sure this one is
legal. 'Legitimate' is a much more subjective term. I simply find the
interpersonal and business ethics of those I have seen the insides of
highly dubious, if not completely lacking. That is simply my
experience of them. The bios of permaworld principals (on the site)
indicate that they are mostly experienced MLM 'professionals' first and
foremost.

My additional experience of hardcore MLMers is that they will use any
angle and population that works to spread their systems. The more
desperate the target population is for 'easy money' (a standard MLM
promise), and/or growth and/or recognition, the better for the
perpetrators. Enviro- and eco-related organizations are overripe for
harvest; especially smaller ones always seem to be struggling to get
money.

As for looking at MLMs through PC lenses...

If I wish to prosper in such a system, I can only do so by expanding
the branch(es) beneath me, the more the better; anyone below me in the
network must do the same to prosper. Thus my reference to an "endless
growth" model.

IBM, and the rest of the currently dominant commerce/business system,
also have an "endless growth" model, no argument there. I doubt this
is a good model for sustainability.

What is being distributed is some fraction of the upflow of money from
a primarily one-way system. I would be curious to see their corporate
financial statements and find out what fraction of money generated is
actually distributed. I haven't found it on their site, of course.

In any case, this is not the same as distributing 'surplus' from a
cyclical/regenerative system (which I assume is what PC ethics is
referring to in 'distribution of surplus').

A diagram of an MLM 'network' will look like a river tributary system,
many small flows feeding into larger and larger and fewer and fewer
streams, then rivers, then into the ocean (or really big lakes, etc.).

The difference is that in the hydrological system, the ocean (or lakes,
etc.) evaporates and goes back up to condense, precipitate on and
replenish the watersheds of all the many many small streams that fed
it.

This does not happen in an MLM. There, the smallest tributaries (at
any given moment) must go out and find even smaller tributaries to feed
them - and so on, and so on, and so on...not cyclical, not
regenerative, and IMO not the least bit sustainable.

I have thus far understood permaculture to observe, recognize, prefer
and advocate cyclical/regenerative models. If this has changed I
missed hearing about it.

Lastly, but not at all leastly, I have absolutely no respect for the
selling of harvesting/spamming systems (Permaworld's primary product),
regardless of how they're marketed or who/what they're supporting.

Hi ho.


=====
John Schinnerer, MA
-------------------------
- Eco-Living -
Cultural & Ecological Designing
Food - Water - Shelter - Community - Technology
john@eco-living.net
http://eco-living.net

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  • Re: [permaculture] Thanks to Permaworld, John Schinnerer, 08/04/2002

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