permaculture

[Claude Genest <genest@together.net>]

Not to duck the question but I guess the answer to your question depends on
the stringency of your requirements for proof.  E.G When you start from a
god-foresaken barren lawn, and mulch it out to plant a small garden and a
few fruit trees, you have 100% more than what was there before, which was
nothing ( less than nothing if you consider the inputs) . This is literally,
visibly, undeniably true.
Other than that, check out the articles that appear monthly in Permaculture
Magazine U.K. On the ground examples are featured every month....

> From: Richard Morris <webmaster@pfaf.org>
> Organization: Plants For A Future
> Reply-To: "permaculture" <permaculture@franklin.oit.unc.edu>
> Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2002 23:19:25 +0000
> To: "permaculture" <permaculture@franklin.oit.unc.edu>
> Subject: Re: Give me an example of PC that is working (was Pc slammed in 
> Whole
> Earth Review)
> 
>> From: "georg parlow" <georg@websuxxess.com>
>> Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 22:56:08 +0100
>> 
>>> ever did measure, he says, the yields of conventional gardens
>> should dwarf
>>> those of forest gardens.
>> 
>> if this is talking about financially quantifiable yield per
>> square unit, the fella is propably right as far as my own
>> observance is going. but this is not what my life is about. i am
>> highly satisfied with a 50% material yield for 10% of the labor
>> input, plus some hard-to-quantify yields like personal
>> relationship with natural cycles, fun, satisfaction and other
>> similar subversive things.
> 
> Yeah, but this is not going to convince the traditional farmer
> across the way. He'll just look at a PC site and see a mess.
> 
> So far I've been very disappointed by the discussion, which basically
> seems to stem round, "We reject the scientific paradime".
> 
> Graham asked a simple question: give me some statistics?
> 
> Answers so far: No, because ... (answer doesn't matter your
> still ducking the question).
> 
>> From this I might conclude, this lot haven't got an example,
> they have a lot of philosophical mutterings and excuses.
> 
> OK here's an easier question: give me an example of permaculture
> which is working. Give me something which I can hold up to the
> world and say "look at this, you can see for yourself that its
> good". 
> 
> So far, I've only seen one example of a good permaculture system:
> a wet land system designed to treat the waste from a Cider farm
> in Herefordshire, England. Its a four acre plot, consisting of
> lots of ponds and swales and planted with 200 species and varieties
> of willows, reeds and other plants. You can see its working as
> some very mucky waste is going in one end and at the other end
> clean water is coming out the other end. Its also producing a lot of
> willows for all the thing willows are good for.
> It was put together by Jay and Claire at Biologic design
> (Graham I've got a contact number if your interested).
> 
> Also John Comden and others in the UK have been doing a PC research
> project, I'm not sure what they have come up with yet.
> 
> I can't really say that the PFAF sites are really working. OK
> we have created a very beautiful place which attracts a lot of
> wildlife, and we do have a lot of interesting species which should
> really be much more widely used (Hippophae salicifolia,
> Elaeagnus x ebbingei, and some others at
> http://www.com.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/index.html#PORTRAIT )
> but on the whole its not really a working system. More due to
> lack of man power than any thing else.
> 
> So has anyone got a good example of a PC system, or part of
> a system which is working?
> 
> Something like, I've x acres of land and I work on it y %
> of my time and its producing z % of my food needs.
> Or are we all nipping down the local shop to buy our potatoes!
> 
> Just give me something solid!
> 
> In peace
> 
> Rich
> 
> --
> Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
> Web:       http://www.pfaf.org/  or  http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
> Main Site: Blagdon Cross, Ashwater, Beaworthy, Devon, EX21 5DF, England
> Tel: (+44 845) 458 4719
> Email:     webmaster@pfaf.org (web related queries only)
> PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> You are currently subscribed to permaculture as: genest@together.net
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-permaculture@franklin.oit.unc.edu
> Get the list FAQ at:
> http://www.ibiblio.org/ecolandtech/documents/permaculture.faq