permaculture

[Richard Morris <webmaster@pfaf.org>]

> From: "georg parlow" <georg@websuxxess.com>
> Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 22:56:08 +0100
> 
> > ever did measure, he says, the yields of conventional gardens
> should dwarf
> > those of forest gardens.
> 
> if this is talking about financially quantifiable yield per
> square unit, the fella is propably right as far as my own
> observance is going. but this is not what my life is about. i am
> highly satisfied with a 50% material yield for 10% of the labor
> input, plus some hard-to-quantify yields like personal
> relationship with natural cycles, fun, satisfaction and other
> similar subversive things.

Yeah, but this is not going to convince the traditional farmer
across the way. He'll just look at a PC site and see a mess.

So far I've been very disappointed by the discussion, which basically
seems to stem round, "We reject the scientific paradime".

Graham asked a simple question: give me some statistics?

Answers so far: No, because ... (answer doesn't matter your
still ducking the question).

>From this I might conclude, this lot haven't got an example,
they have a lot of philosophical mutterings and excuses.

OK here's an easier question: give me an example of permaculture
which is working. Give me something which I can hold up to the
world and say "look at this, you can see for yourself that its 
good". 

So far, I've only seen one example of a good permaculture system:
a wet land system designed to treat the waste from a Cider farm
in Herefordshire, England. Its a four acre plot, consisting of
lots of ponds and swales and planted with 200 species and varieties
of willows, reeds and other plants. You can see its working as
some very mucky waste is going in one end and at the other end
clean water is coming out the other end. Its also producing a lot of
willows for all the thing willows are good for.
It was put together by Jay and Claire at Biologic design
(Graham I've got a contact number if your interested).

Also John Comden and others in the UK have been doing a PC research
project, I'm not sure what they have come up with yet.

I can't really say that the PFAF sites are really working. OK
we have created a very beautiful place which attracts a lot of
wildlife, and we do have a lot of interesting species which should
really be much more widely used (Hippophae salicifolia, 
Elaeagnus x ebbingei, and some others at 
        http://www.com.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/index.html#PORTRAIT )
but on the whole its not really a working system. More due to
lack of man power than any thing else.

So has anyone got a good example of a PC system, or part of
a system which is working? 

Something like, I've x acres of land and I work on it y %
of my time and its producing z % of my food needs.
Or are we all nipping down the local shop to buy our potatoes!

Just give me something solid!

        In peace

                Rich

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