North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Bob Randall <YearRoundGardening@comcast.net>]

What Lee says is true also.  Trees can live in all sorts of crazy places and 
even “thrive.” I have seen them on rock cliffs. 
I used to live on the edge of the Sahara.  There was a famous tree “The Tree 
of Teneré”.  Nothing at all living around it for miles/kilometers.  See for 
yourself. Do an image search or

http://www.weirduniverse.net/blog/categories/C53/P20/ 
<http://www.weirduniverse.net/blog/categories/C53/P20/>

But they will do best with rotted lignin materials.

Bob


"Share What You Grow and What You Know!"

Bob Randall. Ph.d.






> On May 24, 2015, at 12:03 PM, Lee Reich <leeareich@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> While what Bob says is true, trees seem to also thrive when growing in 
> grass, as long as it’s not too competitive (i.e. mowed low and frequently), 
> or being mulched with low lignin materials. 
> 
> I once had to chuckle at a presentation by Dr. Ingaham, when she was 
> espousing the need of trees for a fungally dominated environment. The 
> audience was nodding their heads in assent as they sat beneath a lusty, 
> mature red oak thriving in mown lawn.
> 
> Lee Reich, PhD
> Come visit my farmden at  http://www.leereich.com/blog 
> <http://www.leereich.com/blog> <http://www.leereich.com/blog 
> <http://www.leereich.com/blog>>
> http://leereich.com/ <http://leereich.com/> <http://leereich.com/ 
> <http://leereich.com/>>
> 
> Books by Lee Reich:
> A Northeast Gardener's Year
> The Pruning Book
> Weedless Gardening
> Uncommon Fruits for Every Garden
> Landscaping with Fruit
> Grow Fruit Naturally
> 
>> On May 24, 2015, at 12:23 PM, Bob Randall <YearRoundGardening@comcast.net 
>> <mailto:YearRoundGardening@comcast.net>> wrote:
>> 
>> With mulch there is always a dilemma between what is desirable and 
>> feasible.  In nature, trees life in places with fungal dominant soils and 
>> prefer a forest floor type mulch with lots of lignin in layers from 
>> uncomposted on top to humus on the bottom.  Grasses with few exceptions 
>> prefer a bacteria dominated soil.  So if you have your choice mulch with 
>> shredded tree branches composted or leaves or straw, but not green 
>> succulent herbaceous material including grass.  See The Soil Biology 
>> Primer at 
>> http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/nrcs/main/soils/health/biology/ 
>> <http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/nrcs/main/soils/health/biology/><http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/nrcs/main/soils/health/biology/
>>  <http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/nrcs/main/soils/health/biology/>> 
>> 
>> All this is made more complicated by the lack of moisture in many places, 
>> so that not only is there not much material to mulch with, but also it 
>> takes forever to rot unless it goes through the gut of animals.
>> 
>> What is possible in any given place therefore is based on knowing what the 
>> aim is and doing your best with in cost and labor constraints to get a 
>> solution. 
>> 
>> I live in warm Houston where in El Nino years it never stops raining it 
>> seems, everything except concrete rots, and branches of trees grow at an 
>> alarming clip, so mulching is simply a matter of finding the time to do 
>> it.  Santa Fe is dry and cold a lot, so not much grows or rots. Your best 
>> bet is to find plant material that is an industrial byproduct I would 
>> guess.
>> 
>> Bob Randall
>> 
>> "Share What You Grow and What You Know!"
>> 
>> Bob Randall, Ph.D.
>> 
>> http://yearroundgardening.me
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On May 24, 2015, at 10:52 AM, Lee Reich <leeareich@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> How about letting the grass grow wherever it wants but keeping it mown 
>>> short. The organic matter from the clippings will improve the soil and 
>>> the constant mowing can keep the grass from becoming too competitive.
>>> 
>>> Lee Reich, PhD
>>> Come visit my farmden at  http://www.leereich.com/blog 
>>> <http://www.leereich.com/blog>
>>> http://leereich.com/ <http://leereich.com/>
>>> 
>>> Books by Lee Reich:
>>> A Northeast Gardener's Year
>>> The Pruning Book
>>> Weedless Gardening
>>> Uncommon Fruits for Every Garden
>>> Landscaping with Fruit
>>> Grow Fruit Naturally
>>> 
>>>> On May 19, 2015, at 8:44 PM, Jay Cutts <orders@cuttsreviews.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Folks,
>>>> 
>>>> Here's a dilemma I've been wrestling with for years. I'm at 7000 feet in 
>>>> NM. I have a number of rather small trees planted out in a field. There 
>>>> is a very invasive grass that grows in the field - I think it's Western 
>>>> Wheat grass - that sends out underground runners for 4 or 5 feet.
>>>> 
>>>> I don't know how to protect the soil immediately under the tree and then 
>>>> out under the drip line and a little further. In some places I've put 
>>>> down two layers of weed barrier, covering maybe a circle with a diameter 
>>>> of 4-5 feet. It does keep the grass from coming through but the grass 
>>>> roots are still pervasive in the covered area. After a while, the 
>>>> grasses do poke through the weed barrier.
>>>> 
>>>> I'd prefer to have a nice circle of organic mulch that would break down 
>>>> in that area but then the grass goes completely wild, growing right 
>>>> through the mulch.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm assuming that letting the grass grow under the tree is bad. I guess 
>>>> it will use up nutrients and just feels like it's choking the tree out.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm wondering if there is something I can plant under the trees that 
>>>> would outcompete the weedy grass. The weed grass doesn't do as well if 
>>>> it gets shaded out (the trees are too small to create shade) though it 
>>>> will still spread.
>>>> 
>>>> If I planted something like alfalfa, could I plant it right up to the 
>>>> base of a young tree? If I leave the area immediately under the tree 
>>>> bare or mulched, the grass will come in.
>>>> 
>>>> We only get 18 inches of rain a year, so anything that is planted for a 
>>>> cover crop is going to have survive on that or it will be stealing water 
>>>> from the tree.
>>>> 
>>>> Another issue is that the soft, mulched and watered area around the base 
>>>> of the trees is perfect for attracting gophers. I've had gophers down a 
>>>> 5 year old tree by gnawing off the base in the winter. Who knows how 
>>>> much other damage they're doing underground to the tree roots. So the 
>>>> nicer I make the soil around the trees, the more gopher damage I have. 
>>>> Help!
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Jay
>>>> 
>>>> Jay Cutts
>>>> Director, Cutts Graduate Reviews
>>>> Lead Author, Barron's MCAT Prep Book
>>>> Lead Author, Barron's MCAT Flash Cards
>>>> Lead Author, Barron's LSAT Prep Book
>>>> (505)-281-0684
>>>> 10 am to 10 pm Mt Time, 7 days
>>>> 
>>>> 
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