North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Devin Smith <dvidedevo@yahoo.com>]

Maybe its because my kiwis are just starting to bear, but I'm so far 
convinced that I can't have too many hardy kiwis. The only problem is that 
trellises require time and money to build, and intensive management to boot. 
I have several kiwis on an rustic locust overhead t-bar trellis that I built, 
and that is well and good, but I'm out of room and would like to plant more 
varieties. So I've been thinking off and on about trellis alternatives. Two 
ideas seem like workable compromises to me:

1. Allow them to ramble up a large shrub or small tree. Big trees are out of 
the question because, among other things, fruit will be out of reach. Not 
going there. But a small fast growing spherical formed tree seems promising. 
I came home from a scion swap with boku cuttings of amazing fantail willow. 
It seems to meet all of the necessary criteria I can envision, growing 
quickly to a height and breadth of 12 ft. or so (I think), perhaps less so 
when doing battle with vigorous arguta vines. Growing quickly and easily from 
cuttings means I needn't put around with establishment, at which point I 
might as well go ahead and build a trellis. I have need of a windbreak, and 
intend to test this theoretical system there. If it works as well as I 
imagine it (on the best days that is) the kiwis will fruit out the perimeter 
of the fantail willow with minimal fussing, and if nothing else, the dense 
tangled growth will make a much better windbreak. 


2. The second idea is actually stolen-- I saw this being done (though 
accidentally) at a local orchard. The aforementioned orchard put in a 
sizeable arguta kiwi patch, but neglected to build trellises for many years. 
Most rambled along the ground, clambering up brambles that grew in the rows. 
In short, it was a total mess. But one happened to have been planted next to 
a single pole perhaps 8 ft. tall. This one vine, as you might imagine, 
climbed the pole, but having reached the top assumed a round form almost like 
a pom pom. It was probably 8 ft in diameter, tendrils reaching nearly to the 
ground, and was absolutely festooned with fruit. These fruits occurred only 
on the very outside of the sphere, mind you, but there were an unbelievable 
number of them. I was saddened to learn upon returning a couple years hence 
that the entire planting had been removed to make way for more apples. I 
guess it had been planted in a frost pocket and so frequently failed
 to produce. Still the image of that one perfect kiwi covered pom pom has 
stuck with me.

I understand that there are several disadvantages to doing things this way. 
Pruning will be made much more difficult, and picking somewhat more so. The 
leaves of the fantail willow may nearly preclude fruiting altogether, though 
maybe less so with a kolomikta. I think the pole idea has real merit, and 
though I've yet to hear of anyone actually doing it on purpose, I know that 
it can work. The key with the pole idea, it seems to me, is to make sure that 
they are spaced widely enough and far enough from things to potentially 
climb, that they instead just make a big messy ball. Any thoughts or 
experiences. 

-Devin Smith
Rockingham, VT
>From qazingulaza@gmail.com  Wed Jul  2 22:04:11 2014
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From: mIEKAL aND <qazingulaza@gmail.com>
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To: Devin Smith <dvidedevo@yahoo.com>,
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Subject: Re: [nafex] kiwi trellis alternatives
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The first patch of argots I planted broke the trellis they were on and =
attached themselves to an ash tree, which each year they pull over more =
and more.  I still have to use an 8 foot step ladder to harvest the top =
part but it works good.  I think if you were ahead of the ballgame you =
could train the tree/trellis  by anchoring the leader.

With kolomiktas I like to use old metal bedsprings sideways and u-bolted =
to t-posts.  I do a couple in a row and it helps create a hedge about 4 =
feet high.

I do almost no pruning whatsoever.

~mIEKAL


On Jul 2, 2014, at 8:45 PM, Devin Smith via nafex wrote:

> Maybe its because my kiwis are just starting to bear, but I'm so far =
convinced that I can't have too many hardy kiwis. The only problem is =
that trellises require time and money to build, and intensive management =
to boot. I have several kiwis on an rustic locust overhead t-bar trellis =
that I built, and that is well and good, but I'm out of room and would =
like to plant more varieties. So I've been thinking off and on about =
trellis alternatives. Two ideas seem like workable compromises to me:
>=20
> 1. Allow them to ramble up a large shrub or small tree. Big trees are =
out of the question because, among other things, fruit will be out of =
reach. Not going there. But a small fast growing spherical formed tree =
seems promising. I came home from a scion swap with boku cuttings of =
amazing fantail willow. It seems to meet all of the necessary criteria I =
can envision, growing quickly to a height and breadth of 12 ft. or so (I =
think), perhaps less so when doing battle with vigorous arguta vines. =
Growing quickly and easily from cuttings means I needn't put around with =
establishment, at which point I might as well go ahead and build a =
trellis. I have need of a windbreak, and intend to test this theoretical =
system there. If it works as well as I imagine it (on the best days that =
is) the kiwis will fruit out the perimeter of the fantail willow with =
minimal fussing, and if nothing else, the dense tangled growth will make =
a much better windbreak.=20
>=20
>=20
> 2. The second idea is actually stolen-- I saw this being done (though =
accidentally) at a local orchard. The aforementioned orchard put in a =
sizeable arguta kiwi patch, but neglected to build trellises for many =
years. Most rambled along the ground, clambering up brambles that grew =
in the rows. In short, it was a total mess. But one happened to have =
been planted next to a single pole perhaps 8 ft. tall. This one vine, as =
you might imagine, climbed the pole, but having reached the top assumed =
a round form almost like a pom pom. It was probably 8 ft in diameter, =
tendrils reaching nearly to the ground, and was absolutely festooned =
with fruit. These fruits occurred only on the very outside of the =
sphere, mind you, but there were an unbelievable number of them. I was =
saddened to learn upon returning a couple years hence that the entire =
planting had been removed to make way for more apples. I guess it had =
been planted in a frost pocket and so frequently failed
> to produce. Still the image of that one perfect kiwi covered pom pom =
has stuck with me.
>=20
> I understand that there are several disadvantages to doing things this =
way. Pruning will be made much more difficult, and picking somewhat more =
so. The leaves of the fantail willow may nearly preclude fruiting =
altogether, though maybe less so with a kolomikta. I think the pole idea =
has real merit, and though I've yet to hear of anyone actually doing it =
on purpose, I know that it can work. The key with the pole idea, it =
seems to me, is to make sure that they are spaced widely enough and far =
enough from things to potentially climb, that they instead just make a =
big messy ball. Any thoughts or experiences.=20
>=20
> -Devin Smith
> Rockingham, VT
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