North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Scott Smith <scott@cs.jhu.edu>]

This is quite a puzzle.  I pruned my Chocolate back this weekend since it had 
finished flowering.  I discovered all the female fruits were on thicker limbs 
of this years growth which tended to be growing more vertically than 
horizontally.  These limbs tended to come out of larger scaffolds or 
branches.  The male limbs were thinner and shorter and tended to come out of 
other smaller branches.  I pruned out much of the male flowering branches and 
hopefully the tree will decide to grow some limbs that will produce female 
shoots next spring.

Anton, your tree sounds like it was in a different state than mine, I got all 
male flowers last spring but had not pruned it much any year up to that.  I 
think I had let the tree get too dense perhaps.  I did do a bit of pruning 
and maybe I was pruning off the more vigorous stuff which would have given me 
female flowers.  Your tree may have reverted to focus away from fruiting to 
rebuild structure after the severe pruning - male flowers take up little 
energy compared to females.

Scott



On Jun 2, 2012, at 9:42 AM, Anton Callaway wrote:

> Scott,
> 
> My 'Chocolate' persimmon bore extremely heavily for several years.  Because 
> it was producing more than we could eat and give away and the tree was 
> getting rather large, I pruned it heavily two years ago.  When it leafed 
> out following this heavy pruning, it flowered very late (about 6 weeks 
> later than usual) and though it flowered even more prolifically than usual, 
> it produced only male blossoms.  Last winter, I pruned it moderately and it 
> was only about a week late, with about 5% female blossoms.  I believe every 
> one of the female blossoms set, so it still will make a good crop.
> 
> I don't know how common this is or whether there is any cause-and-effect to 
> the pruning & blossoming, but I've found it interesting.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Anton
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Scott Smith <scott@cs.jhu.edu>
>> Sent: May 30, 2012 9:40 AM
>> To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nafex] Getting a Chocolate kaki to make more female flowers
>> 
>> Jerry, I did put some compost, fertilizer, and bark mulch on the tree this 
>> spring (and every previous spring) so I the soil should be good.  The 
>> flower types do seem to cluster by branchlet.  I wonder if older branches 
>> are more likely to turn to male flowers and I need to let the tree send up 
>> some new shoots which will start female?  When the flowering is done this 
>> year I will give parts of the tree with no fruits a strong pruning and see 
>> what that does for next year.
>> 
>> Scott
>> 
>> On May 30, 2012, at 7:03 AM, Jwlehman@aol.com wrote:
>> 
>>> In a message dated 5/29/2012 8:38:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
>>> scott@cs.jhu.edu writes:
>>> 
>>>> My Chocolate persimmon has been making almost exclusively male flowers 
>>>> for the last couple of years.  It used to be more balanced male/female 
>>>> and I 
>>>> would get a tree load of fruit.  Is there something I should do to 
>>>> change 
>>>> the balance?  I haven't pruned it much at all so I would not be 
>>>> surprised if 
>>>> that had something to do with it.
>>>> 
>>>> Scott
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Good Morning Scott,
>>> 
>>> Interesting, very interesting. I have never head this complaint before. 
>>> I've heard of persimmon trees effectively switching sexual expression, 
>>> your is 
>>> the first  first hand account. 
>>> 
>>> I know of only one D. virginiana cultivar that bears both pistillate and 
>>> staminate flowers, Szukis. It is unstable and switches sexual expression 
>>> when 
>>> grafting. 
>>> 
>>> Question, were the pistillate and staminate flowers intermixed on the 
>>> same 
>>> branchlets? Or were some branches male and some branches female? If the 
>>> later is the case would pruning out the branches that are bearing the 
>>> staminate 
>>> flowers bring the tree into balance?  I doubt if just pruning limbs 
>>> randomly 
>>> would bring back the female flowers. 
>>> 
>>>> From what you wrote the tree has been there quite a few years. What 
>>>> about 
>>> soil nutrition?  Has the tree depleted the soil of what it needs?  Then 
>>> what 
>>> to feed it? Do you have a good supply of compost? Enough for maybe in 
>>> inch 
>>> ground coverage under the tree and beyond the drop line. Or some low 
>>> nitrogen 
>>> fertilizer, something like 0-20-20.  
>>> 
>>> I admit I'm just guessing.
>>> 
>>> Jerry
>>> 
>>> 
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