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[list@ginda.us]

If a large catalog grower, selling standard varieties, is communicating  
clearly, they will give a range of USDA zones that the plant is hardy  
in, possibly with some commentary about the differences between western  
and eastern, or inland and coastal conditions.  If this grower just  
says "hardy", they really aren't telling you anything.

If a small catalog grower, selling oddball stuff, describes something  
as "hardy", it means that it does well where-ever they are located in  
almost all years.  If they say "very hardy", it means this one had less  
damage than other cultivars one year when they had a very harsh winter.  
 If they say "moderately hardy", it means they can grow it, but they  
have to protect the plant, or they get a little damage every year, or  
they get some damage every few years.


There aren't a lot of nurseries in my area, so I'm usually buying from  
people either well north or well south of me.  As a result, I generally  
look for "very hardy" or else will take anything even "somewhat tender"  
or "moderately hardy".  Rarely do I look for plants that are at least  
"hardy".  :)

Ginda
eastern Mass., zone 6

On Jan 11, 2004, at 10:52 AM, Tom Olenio wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I would prefer a specific temperature be given for hardiness, for  
> although not absolute, it would be lot less vague.  However, that is  
> just wishful thinking.
>
> How does a large catalog grower, that has a very wide market (even  
> national), use terms that have "local" connotations to indicate  
> hardiness?.
>
> Maybe the USDA defines these terms somewhere???
>
> Tom
>  
>  
>
> Dean Kreutzer wrote:
> >In regards to grapes, what do these terms mean in hardiness  
> temperature
> >degree ranges;
> >
> >      moderately hardy
> >      hardy
> >      very hardy
> >
> >These terms may be used rather loosely in catalogs, but there must be  
> a
> >rather standard definition.
>
> I think any catlalog that used these terms to describe hardiness  
> either did
> not do enough fact finding or just didn't care enough to print them.   
> The
> meaning of these terms are highly dependant on where a person is  
> located;
> where I live I would say that -40F is very hardy, on the east coast it  
> might
> be -30F, down south it might be -20F or -10F, etc.  This is like  
> asking a
> person how tall they are and getting replies like "Tall/Average/Short".
>
> Where I live, we are pretty much guaranteed -35F every year, yet we  
> have
> plants like Bartlett pears, and Himrod/Flame Seedless grapes in our  
> retail
> chain stores with the word "hardy" in their descriptions.  I find this  
> very
> unprofessional and misleading, especially to the general consumer who  
> may
> not be the wiser.
>
> I would think that most fruiting plants should have at least a USDA or
> Canada hardiness zone rating that can be applied.
>
> Dean
> USDA zone 3
>
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> --
> Thomas Olenio
> Ontario, Canada
> Hardiness Zone 5b
>  
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