Healthy soil and sustainable growing

["Greg and April" <gregandapril@earthlink.net>]

At the same time Paul, I have already seen some organic vegetables in a 
couple of local Wal-Mart's, and they were priced about the same as the same 
brand ( Melissa's ) in other grocery stores, which is to say higher than the 
cost of mass market vegetables.    Some local stores don't even carry " 
organic ", unless it is a major name brand.

If ( and I say IF ), Wal-Mart, wanted to, they could still offer hi quality 
food stuffs at a lower price, by, spreading the cost across it's other 
merchandise, in fact I think they already do that to an extent, because 
going to an organic specialty store, I have seen Melissa's vegetables at a 
higher price's than at Wal-Mart.

By the same token, Wal-Mart could, actually make organic foodstuffs more 
profitable for the organic producer, by making them more accessible to 
people that would not otherwise have them.

The first time that I saw Melissa's organic vegetables at Wal-Mart, was 
about 4 years ago, so it's hardly a new thing.


Greg H.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "TradingPostPaul" <tradingpost@riseup.net>
To: <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 13:32
Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] Organic delusions


> Very interesting points on this from several people. Here's the original
> section that ran up red flags for me, and my comments on it below.
>
> "... the main reasons for higher organic prices are structural and will
> stick around for the long term or foment a huge ruckus when Wal-Mart
> insists on diluting organic methods. ... But there's no excuse other than
> yuppie snobbery for charging extra for plain organic potatoes, carrots,
> spinach and breads, many non-organic customers complain.  Having long
> suffered from this double standard on food prices, those who know and
> respect what organic food is about are pretty defensive about its high
> prices. In contrast with the artificially low price of synthetic or
> industrialized food, the relatively high price of organics captures
> something like the full cost and value of growing and marketing real food
> that meets environmental and human health needs.
>
> "But organic producers can't externalize costs without losing their way.
> They can't dump manure from factory barns into rivers and then buy 
> chemical
> fertilizers; they have to compost manure and return it to the soil, which
> is more expensive. They can't grow miles of one crop and spray with
> chemicals; to discourage pests, they have to grow a wide range of crops,
> which is more labour-intensive and expensive.
>
> "They can't jam produce into a truck, then spray it with fungicides that
> keep it from spoiling and gases that keep it from looking haggard;
> post-harvest handling has to be quick, skilled and careful, which costs
> money.
>
> "The only way to mess with organic prices is to mess with organic rules,
> already under constant pressure in the U.S., where the Department of
> Agriculture controls the organic label and has allowed standards to erode
> to the point where factory-style cow and livestock barns are setting the
> norm."
> ---------
>
> My thoughts on this hot NM afternoon waiting for rain (had less than 4" so
> far all year):
>
> I tend to agree with those who predict "organic" will get watered down 
> more
> and more, though big box stores will have a harder time with just in time
> "organic inventory" and will bypass the little grower completely.
>
> Most big box stores will not support locally grown organics; for the most
> part they'll sell packaged stuff trucked in from China, Mexico, or halfway
> across this country.  For their fresh produce they can still truck it in
> coolers from Arizona, Florida, or Imperial Valley, and it'll be hard to 
> cut
> prices on it because of transportation costs.  What China-Mart will do is
> what they always do, force suppliers to cut their costs by buying in bulk
> on contract, constantly threatening to desert them and go to their
> competition. So called "organic" prices will go down some relative to 
> other
> foods.
>
> Let's keep in mind, they can still meet "organic" regulations with produce
> that's bred for mechanical handling and shipping - tomatoes you can use 
> for
> baseballs, tasteless melons, and so on. Just withhold chemicals 
> (allegedly)
> and ship'em out. All organic, huh.
>
> That said, we local growers can survive and profit far more by playing to
> their weaknesses. We already know reliable practices to cut costs and 
> labor
> dramatically that they can't make use of. We can grow tastier and more
> nutritious produce, and sell locally without worrying about loss in
> shipping and handling. And we have to do this.
>
> Besides families growing their own as they're able, we need a few million
> growing to feed their local communities and doing it right to live on the
> money they make from it. Not impractical at all. There's no other way for
> what's coming. There's no other way for thousands of local communities
> right now.