Cc-uk mailing list

["Andrew Katz" <andrew AT thekatzfamily.co.uk>]

As a lawyer myself, I don't subscribe to the theory that lawyers promote 
protection of rights because they stand to gain more from it. I'm not even 
sure that that's true (although it could well be - I simply haven't done the 
analysis).

It's more likely to be the case that (1) their training consists almost 
exclusively of learning what rights exist and how to protect them and (2) 
they are likely to be instructed by clients who are always asking for more 
and more protection.

They are unlikely to have even considered the alternative economic analysis. 
I stressed the point in my review of Lessig's The Future of Ideas for 
Computers and Law magazine that although family lawyers and criminal lawyers 
(for example) are affected by laws which affect their clients very directly 
and personally, that's just not the case  for IP lawyers. Criminal lawyers 
and family lawyers are therefore more likely be able to talk about the 
societal effects of the legislation and practice they deal with daily, than 
IP lawyers, who in all probability don't even think about it. I am staggered 
by the average IP lawyer's failure to grasp the wider context of the work 
they do.

Then again, I suspect that not many IP lawyers (unlike me) have released 
software under the GPL and therefore understand the dynamic of open 
licensing from the other side of the fence.

As an aside, it's interesting how little respect lawyers have for IP rights 
themselves. Most law firms have a "precedent bank" of documents which they 
use as templates for the documents they are asked to produce in their 
business. Traditionally, these are added to in a number of different ways: 
they are carried from one law firm from another as lawyers move; as lawyers 
come across documents prepared by lawyers on the other side, they will tweak 
them and incorporate them into their precedent; lawyers will buy in 
precedents prepared by third parties. All these lawyers are benefiting from 
the "standing on the shoulders of others" benefits akin to those available 
under a creative commons structure. However, lawyers are starting to get 
wise to this and are trying to protect their IP more and more.....

- Andrew


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <cc-uk-request AT lists.ibiblio.org>
To: <cc-uk AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2004 5:00 PM
Subject: Cc-uk Digest, Vol 11, Issue 4


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> Today's Topics:
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>   1. Own IT! Creative london advice service (Nick Hill)
>   2. RE: Own IT! Creative london advice service (Simon Byles)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2004 19:12:16 +0000
> From: Nick Hill <nick AT nickhill.co.uk>
> Subject: [Cc-uk] Own IT! Creative london advice service
> To: FSFE-UK List <fsfe-uk AT gnu.org>, cc-uk AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID: <41B20C10.7030007 AT nickhill.co.uk>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> A friend went to a Creative London seminar. The bias was heavily towards
> locking down works and creativity. Disturbed and with good intent, He
> made a suggestion that they hold a seminar on creative commons and free
> software with the idea of broadening their horizon.
>
> This appears to be a response to his suggestion.
> http://www.own-it.org/events/details/?eventId=33
>
> Which starts "Piracy. File sharing. Viral marketing. Open source,
> copyleft and Creative Commons. How do you protect your ideas and work
> when everything seems downloadable in the internet age?"
>
> Speakers are:
> Alex Chapman and Paul Randle, Solicitors, and Miles Jacobson, Managing
> Director of Sports Interactive (SI), the creator of the new title
> Football Manager 2005,
>
> It is therefore not surprising how skewed the summary of the speech is
> towards monopolising works. Two of the three speakers are in the legal
> sector which stands to gain from monopolisation of culture.
>
> There is no entry fee. There are 39 spaces currently available.
>
> This is a partnership between
> http://www.creativelondon.org.uk/
> and
> http://www.lcc.arts.ac.uk/
>
> A lively Q&A section where informed members take the alternative
> position could be fun, however, creativelondon and lcc need to be
> convinced there is an alternative to locking down/ monopolising works.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 22:21:12 -0000
> From: "Simon Byles" <simon AT byles.name>
> Subject: RE: [Cc-uk] Own IT! Creative london advice service
> To: <cc-uk AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <E1FEB15D7C898049A6F86E8A30E8B1681F13 AT simon.byles.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Sounds interesting, though I agree it's an unusual angle to say the
> least. I've booked a place out of curiosity and there are now 36 spaces
> free.
>
> Thanks for the heads up, Nick.
>
> Simon.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cc-uk-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:cc-uk-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Nick Hill
> Sent: 04 December 2004 19:12
> To: FSFE-UK List; cc-uk AT lists.ibiblio.org
> Subject: [Cc-uk] Own IT! Creative london advice service
>
> A friend went to a Creative London seminar. The bias was heavily towards
> locking down works and creativity. Disturbed and with good intent, He
> made a suggestion that they hold a seminar on creative commons and free
> software with the idea of broadening their horizon.
>
> This appears to be a response to his suggestion.
> http://www.own-it.org/events/details/?eventId=33
>
> Which starts "Piracy. File sharing. Viral marketing. Open source,
> copyleft and Creative Commons. How do you protect your ideas and work
> when everything seems downloadable in the internet age?"
>
> Speakers are:
> Alex Chapman and Paul Randle, Solicitors, and Miles Jacobson, Managing
> Director of Sports Interactive (SI), the creator of the new title
> Football Manager 2005,
>
> It is therefore not surprising how skewed the summary of the speech is
> towards monopolising works. Two of the three speakers are in the legal
> sector which stands to gain from monopolisation of culture.
>
> There is no entry fee. There are 39 spaces currently available.
>
> This is a partnership between
> http://www.creativelondon.org.uk/
> and
> http://www.lcc.arts.ac.uk/
>
> A lively Q&A section where informed members take the alternative
> position could be fun, however, creativelondon and lcc need to be
> convinced there is an alternative to locking down/ monopolising works.
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> End of Cc-uk Digest, Vol 11, Issue 4
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