Biblical Hebrew Forum

[K Randolph <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>]

Randall:

After years of just reading for meaning (hence the writing of a dictionary)
while ignoring grammar, I find these forays into grammar both interesting
and educational.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Randall Buth <randallbuth AT gmail.com> wrote:

> >>As an example, if a student asked permission from a
> teacher to leave a class, would they use אצאה/אעזבה נא, or הבה לי
> לעזוב/לצאת, or תן לי לעזוב/לצאת, or הניחה לי לעזוב/צאת, or הרשני לצאת, or
> what?”
> >can you give any Biblical examples of any of those?
>
> That was my question, the list is intended to stimulate discussion.
> Something of the following was desired.
>
> Which structures were available?
> The list was intended to stimulate, not be inclusive or exclusive.
> But surely you could find first person prefix forms with +ah for statments
> of permission?
> E.g. Gen 19.8 אוציאה- נא
> Jud 15.1 אבאה אל אשתי
> They were the 'corrrect' or 'best' answer in the list.
>

Looking at Tanakh, this is a special case that afflicts only the first
person singular and plural yiqtol verbs. The -H suffix gives the meaning
“let me …” where it is usually, though not always, followed by נא. Where the
-H suffix is overridden by a pronominal suffix, the נא is present.

This is the form asking for permission.

>
> הבה is used in situations like Gen 11.3, 4, 7, and Jud 20:7 as well as
> singular situations like Gen 29.21 הבה לי (where its original meaning
> 'give'
> fits) and Gen 38.16 הבה נא אבוא אליך, but is it good for a classroom? I
> would think not, unless it might have provided a formalism for student to
> teacher. But the overall structure is not attested [while נתן 'give' is
> attested with a following infinitive, the relatively rare יהב 'give' is
> not], so it is best not to use. The point is to show that there may have
> been such a structure, to give some awareness of potential holes in system.
>

>From what I found, הבה Let ... (followed by a yiqtol verb), not from the
root יהב . It is found only four times, Genesis 11:3, 4, 7, Exodus 1:10.

All the other times where I found הבה used, it is used in the general
context of “to hand over, to deliver” an object or a service. This use is
from the root יהב.

>
> Similarly with תן 'give' and הנח 'place'. both verbs are attested in
> contexts where they can mean 'allow, give permission'. See Jud 15.1 above:
> ולא נתנו אביה לבוא 'and her father did not give him [=permit him] to "go
> in".' There are multiple permutations, of course, תן, תן לי, תנה, תנה לי,
> תן
> נא, תן נא לי, הנח, הנח לי, הניחה לי, הנח נא, הנח נא לי, הניחה נא לי. I
> doubt
> whether all of the permutations are attested, I haven't checked. It is open
> for constructive discussion. In any case the imperative with an infinitive
> is not used for requesting permission in the Bible.
>
> The last item הרשני לצאת 'permit me to go out' was a purposeful example of
> potential Late Biblical
> Hebrew. Checking on this here, I find that a noun (רשיון) is attested in
> Ezra and the verb is attested in DSS  (Dam. 11.20). Should one exclude it,
> or include it? Personally, I don't see any problem with it and it fits the
> SecondTemple language, but I don't use it in class (nor would I assume that
> Brian would, specifically because there are people out there looking for
> excuses not to use this methodology.) [PS: The question of how much Second
> Temple 'high' Hebrew to allow is a policy question with no 'right' answer.
> On the side, I certainly disagree with the assumption that there were no
> mother-tongue Hebrew speakers in the SecondTemple period. There certainly
> were, and those in the last two to four generations with competency in all
> the necessary data and skills to deal with the question agree with me. But
> if you wish to differ, please start another thread. Your difference has
> been
> duly noted, and registered as 'doubtful'.]
>

There is no credible evidence I have seen to support this assertion.
Emotionally, I’d prefer it to be true, but with the lack of evidence I have
to conclude it to be unfounded.

>
> >The closest I can
> > think of would be “May I go out?” אצא נא החוצה
> Yes, אצא נא החוצה works.
> And I am perfectly happy with 1 Sam 22.3 as PARTIAL support. Of course, it
> is a third person quotation where the 'ah' ending was not an option. So for
> the first person one might expect both אצאה נא and אצא נא and also  אצאה
> and potentially even אצא. Lamed-alef verbs frequently omit the -ah option,
> but they also include them. And other verbs more frequently use the -ah
> ending, (lamed-yod, a.k.a. lamed-he, excepted, of course).
>
> On vocab, לצאת is more appropriate than לעזוב in most situations.
>

Well, from meaning, the first means exiting, the second the idea of leaving
behind, abandoning. In requesting permission to exit a room, the second
doesn’t fit.

>
> The point of this excercise is to see an area where bHebrew may prefer to
> handle something syntactically, e.g. אכתבה "I would write [in an
> appropriate
> context='let me write']" rather than lexically with a list of potential
> idioms.
>
> The whole process is quite heuristic  Many a Hebrew teacher will enjoy the
> process when teaching classes communicatively. As a benefit, they will end
> up controlling Hebrew much better than merely extrapolating from
> 'grammar-translation'.
>
> --
> Randall Buth, PhD
> www.biblicallanguagecenter.com
> Biblical Language Center
> Learn Easily - Progress Further - Remember for Life
>
> In closing, the request “May I leave the room?” is not found in Tanakh, so
any such request would have to be reconstructed.

Karl W. Randolph.