Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Isaac Fried <if AT math.bu.edu>]

It is dangerous business to pick out roots out of names, and it may  
be misleading to attach to a root too an abstract a meaning, say  
'consecrate' to XRM. I think XRM is related to GRM of 2 kings 9:13.
XERMON could be possibly a compacted form of the compounds HAR-RAM-) 
ON or KAR-RAM-)ON, or HAR-MA(ON or KAR-MA(ON, or who nows what. BA(AL  
is (= BA) essentially something lofty, as indicated by the letter L  
present in it, as in (PL [see Numbers 14:44.]

Isaac Fried
Boston University

On Sep 8, 2008, at 12:57 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:

> Dear Kelton,
>
> More up-to-date archaeological data make it clear that there was  
> never a "city" on the peak of Mt. Hermon. There are a few villages  
> and some open-air cult sites, although none that I know of go back  
> to the early Iron Age, which would be the relevant period. However,  
> the Bible never actually says that Baal-Hermon was a "city". It  
> makes a lot of sense to assume that there was a site dedicated to  
> the worship of Baal on the peak of Hermon - we know that Baal was  
> often associated with such peaks, such as Carmel and Baal-Zaphon.  
> The name Hermon even seems to be derived from the root XRM -  
> "consecrated". However there is no evidence, from either  
> inscriptions or archaeology that such a place actually existed.  
> PLUS, as I wrote before, Judges 3:3 seems to be a textual  
> conflation of Josh. 13:5, which actually mentions "Baal-Gad under  
> Mount Hermon".
>
> Yigal Levin
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: kgraham0938 AT comcast.net
>   To: Yigal Levin ; b-hebrew
>   Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 2:22 AM
>   Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Baal-Hermon
>
>
>   BDB, seems to think BA'AL HERMON is an actual city.
>
>   BA'AL HERMON a city so named as seat of the worship of Baal. ‘The  
> crest of Hermon is strewn with ruins and the foundations of a  
> circular temple of large hewn stones,’ Tristr:Tpg, cf. on  
> sacredness, Euseb. Lag:Onom 217: possibly = BA'AL GAD
>
>   I'm wondering if it is possible that the various names in 1 Chron  
> may refer to two different peaks?
>
>   BDB says that Sener and Hermon are probably referring to these  
> two peaks in 1 Chronicles
>
>   It has three peaks; and the names Hermon and Sener  
> aredistinguished in 1 Ch 5:23 Ct 4:8, may refer to two of these peaks;
>
>   So maybe Ba'al Hermon is referring to an actual city & Hermon in  
> 1 Ch is referring to one of the peaks of the mountain.
>
>   --
>   Kelton Graham
>   KGRAHAM0938 AT comcast.net
>
>     -------------- Original message --------------
>     From: Yigal Levin <leviny1 AT mail.biu.ac.il>
>
> > I'll re-state the problem. While (Mount) Hermon is well-known and  
> > appears quite
> > a few times in the Bible, the specific form "Baal-Hermon" appears  
> > in ONLY two
> > sources, and both are problematic:
> > The first is in the boundary description of Judges 3:3: instead of  
> > Joshua's
> > "Baal-Gad under Mount Hermon", Judges has "Baal-Hermon". Were this  
> > the ONLY
> > source, there would be little doubt that this is a "ghost name"  
> > created by
> > Judges' abbreviation of Josh. 13:5
> >
> > However, there's 1 Chr. 5. The geographical context is close  
> > enough to make it
> > unlikely that this is a different place with the same name (unless  
> > there's
> > another Hermon as well...). Where did Chr.'s description come  
> > from? If it is
> > tak en from a source that is ultimately independent of Judges 3:3,  
> > that would be
> > evidence of "Baal-Hermon" being a real place, which would force a  
> > re-asessment
> > of the realationship between Judges 3:3 and Josh. 13:5 (that the  
> > former is NOT
> > just an abbreviation of the latter). If not, then we have to  
> > understand why Chr.
> > took only that term from Judges 3:3, in a description that seems  
> > related to
> > Deut. 3.
> >
> > Yigal Levin
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: kgraham0938 AT comcast.net
> > To: Yigal Levin ; b-hebrew ; biblical-studies AT yahoogroups.com ;
> > biblicalist AT yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2008 4:24 AM
> > Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Baal-Hermon
> >
> >
> > I'm wondering if BAAL-HERMON is referring to the high places that  
> > exist on top
> > of Mt Hermon. Or maybe the NIV rendering is correct and take those  
> > vavs as
> > appositional.
> >
> > ; 1 Chr onicles 5:23 The people of the half-tribe of Manasseh were  
> > numerous;
> > they settled in the land from Bashan to Baal Hermon, that is, to  
> > Senir (Mount
> > Hermon).
> >
> >
> > --
> > Kelton Graham
> > KGRAHAM0938 AT comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message --------------
> > From: Yigal Levin
> >
> > > Baal-Hermon appears in the boundary of the land not conquered by  
> > > Joshua,
> > > according to the abbreviated description in Judges 3:3: "From Mount
> > Baal-Hermon
> > > unto Lebo-Hamath". In the more complete text in Josh. 13:5, the same
> > boundary is
> > > described as stretching "from Baal-Gad under Mount Hermon unto
> > Lebo-Hamath."
> > > While some scholars have attempted to explain the name "Baal- 
> > > Hermon" as
> > > designating the peak of Mount Hermon, overlooking Baal-Gad itself
> > (probably in
> > > the sout hern Ba qa', near Hasbayeh), most assume either that the  
> > > names are
> > > synonymous, or even that the version in Judges is erroneous, a  
> > > "ghost
> > > place-name" caused by the abbreviated boundary-list. However Baal- 
> > > Hermon
> > is also
> > > given as part of the bounda ry of the Transjordanian half-tribe of
> > Menasseh in 1
> > > Chr. 5:23: "from Bashan unto Baal-Hermon and Senir and Mount  
> > > Hermon". This
> > could
> > > be seen either as evidence of there actually being such a place,  
> > > which was
> > known
> > > to either the Chronicler or his immediate source, even though
> > > it is not mentioned anywhere else, or of the fact that the  
> > > Chronicler or
> > his
> > > immediate source, when composing his description of the Menassite
> > territory,
> > > chose to combine this particular element from Judges 3:3 with the  
> > > other
> > names
> > > that seem more based on Deut. 3:8-13 (w hich is the only other  
> > > place in
> > which
> > > Hermon, Senir and Bashan are listed together, in a description of  
> > > the
> > > Transjordanian tribes).
> > >
> > > So which is it: is there such a place (and where is it), or did the
> > Chronicler
> > > pick up a "ghost-name" from an unexpected source?
> > >
> > > Yigal Levin
> > > _________________________________ _______ _______
> > > b-hebrew mailing list
> > > b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-hebrew
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