Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Read, James C" <K0434995 AT kingston.ac.uk>]

QUOTE
Rolf, if you accept, as you seem to, that the theophoric prefix was 
pronounced something like YEHO- with the vav as a vowel (and not for 
example YEHAWA- with a consonantal vav), your arguments would seem to 
imply that the vav in the full divine name is also a vowel. That would 
in fact suggest that the full divine name is something like YEHO or 
YAHU, with the final he as a redundant mater lectionis. This form would 
also explain the variants YHW and YHH, with the redundancy removed.
END QUOTE

Now this is the only bisyllabic argument I've seen that holds any water 
and worth definitely considering in a scholarly manner.
Although, the rather string argument about the psalms would seem to 
contradict.


-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of Peter Kirk
Sent: Sun 1/8/2006 6:26 PM
To: Rolf Furuli
Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Theophoric Name: Y:HOWYFQIYM
 
On 07/01/2006 21:18, Rolf Furuli wrote:

>...
>
>Arguments must be evaluated on the basis of quality and not on the basis 
>of quantity.  Please give a scholarly answer to the following question:  
>In the Elephantine letters we find the letters YHW for the god that was 
>worshipped by the community. What are the Aramaic  (or Hebrew) 
>*phonological* reasons for pronouncing these three letters as YAHU?  Are 
>there any phonological reasons that forbids that the three letters are 
>consonants and that they were pronounciated YEHOWA, or YAHOWA, or 
>YEHOWE, or YAHOWA?
>  
>

Or for that matter YEHAWA, YEHIWA etc? Or YAHWE, YAHWA etc? Since you 
are making the W here a consonant, there is no reason to read a long O 
vowel here, rather than another vowel or a silent sheva. And in fact it 
is rare to have a long O vowel not marked with a vav (which, by the way, 
Jack, is the internationally standardised name for the sixth letter of 
the Hebrew alphabet, regardless of pronunciation as [v], [w] or a 
vowel). So, if the original pronunciation was something like YEHOWA, 
with both a long O vowel and a consonantal vav, one would expect that 
someone somewhere would have written a double vav here. But as far as I 
know no one ever had. I think that is quite a strong argument against 
forms like Jehovah.

Rolf, if you accept, as you seem to, that the theophoric prefix was 
pronounced something like YEHO- with the vav as a vowel (and not for 
example YEHAWA- with a consonantal vav), your arguments would seem to 
imply that the vav in the full divine name is also a vowel. That would 
in fact suggest that the full divine name is something like YEHO or 
YAHU, with the final he as a redundant mater lectionis. This form would 
also explain the variants YHW and YHH, with the redundancy removed.

-- 
Peter Kirk
peter AT qaya.org (personal)
peterkirk AT qaya.org (work)
http://www.qaya.org/

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From: "Read, James C" <K0434995 AT kingston.ac.uk>
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Re origin of namelessness:

I wonder if this can bring anything of value to the discussion:
23  For instance, while passing along and carefully observing YOUR objects of 
veneration I also found an altar on which had been inscribed ‘To an Unknown 
God.’ Therefore what YOU are unknowingly giving godly devotion to, this I am 
publishing to YOU (Acts 17:23)

Re pronunciation evidences.

The problem with hebrew pronunciations is that we rely heavily on the 
masoretic
model which is much later than the Greek transliterations. So maybe it is not 
altogether wise to brush off Greek transliterations especially those we see 
in 
the LXX as they may be far older and more reliable than evidence we glean 
from 
the masoretes.

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Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2006 08:33:56 +0200
From: Rochelle Altman <willaa AT netvision.net.il>
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Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Theophoric Name: Y:HOWYFQIYM
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At 06:13 AM 1/9/2006, Harold Holmyard wrote:

>Rochelle Altman wrote:
>
> >(I did write up a requested report on the Zoilos Inscription; it's in the
> >article archives on Orion.)
> >

>HH: How does one get there, please? Looking up data in the B-Hebew
>archives requires a month, and I do not see it in the last two. Is Orion
>another storage place, or a subject heading, or a web site? Thanks.
>
>Yours,
>Harold Holmyard


Dear Harold,

ORION is the Center for the Study of the Dead Sea Scrolls at the Hebrew
University of Jerusalem. The e-list has closed, but the site is still
operative with bibliographies and articles remaining available.

Zoilos is at:

http://orion.mscc.huji.ac.il/orion/programs/Altman/Altman00.shtml

Regards,

Rochelle
R.I.S. Altman, PhD

PS: Jack, if the WAW was only vocalic, then somebody had better explain why
the ca. 9th-BCE so-called digamma of Ionian Greek is the *consonantal*  VAV
-- that's why it was later dropped.  The voiced phoneme was covered by
voiced beta and the unvoiced phoneme was covered by phi. The vocalic WAW is
upsilon. WAW is also consonantal in the earliest Etruscan (ca. 10th-8th BCE).