Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Tna Swg <tnaswg AT yahoo.com>]

Hebraiste,
 
Note in Theology Today 62 (2005): 342-51, JL Hooper. John Courtney Murray, SJ 
(1904-67): Working with God for comments that reflect on exhaustive truth 
from a different lens.
 
Marc Bauer

Shoshanna Walker <rosewalk AT concentric.net> wrote:
How could you say that? Do you know all of the Oral Torah that was 
written down? Some of it is extremely detailed in such matters as 
you describe below, and you can refer to the writings of Aryeh 
Kaplan, some of which demonstrate how advancing science is revealing 
truths that were long ago revealed by Oral Torah.

Shoshanna




Shoshanna:

Even if you include all the Oral Torah as part of God's
revelation, it still does not teach exhaustive truth.

Even for a past event, in this case the creation, Torah
does not report all the details of the creation, the
incredible and irreduceable complexity of all life, the
Krebs cycle within the cells, the organelles which are still
"black boxes" where, in spite of the efforts of researchers,
they still don't know what goes on in them, and so forth.
All life is to reproduce "after its own kind" but it doesn't
explain the actions of the DNA, nor the other bio-chemical
machinery that regulates such replication, nor does it
even define what a "kind" is and how it differs from
"species".

In short, while the text clearly teaches that God created the
universe, and that within six literal days, it leaves out most
of the details. Hence true truth, but not exhaustive truth.

Karl W. Randolph.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Shoshanna Walker" 
>
> Actually it does, but the written Torah is only part of the Torah -
> all of it together, teaches exhaustive truth.
>
> Shoshanna
>
>
>
> Francis Schaeffer probably had the best answer, in his
> claim that while the Bible teaches true truth, it does not
> teach exhaustive truth.
>
> A modern example, I can say "the car went down the
> road." While that is true, it does not say how fast, who
> drove it, whether it is a steam, electric or gas car, what
> color it is, and any number of other truths about the car
> going down the road.

-- 
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 Can you name one example where an ancient script is phonetic?  What are 
all the examples of alphabetic writing systems' that you have seen which are
phonetic?  I have searched for these and cannot find one, apart *perhaps*
for Phoenician, which is claimed to have been phonemic.  How do you know if
the spelling is 'fluid' or fixed?  If you want to see what happens when
spellings are not fixed, perhaps you should actually look at the texts
rather than a 'normalised' transcription where some scholar has standardised
all the spellings.  Middle English is a good place to start.  If you prefer
older texts, although not alphabetic, Akkadian I believe offers a variety of
ways of presenting words, as does Ugaritic.  What texts exactly are you
basing your theory on??

Kevin Riley
 
-------Original Message-------
 
From: Karl Randolph
Date: 11/04/05 05:37:00
 
Peter:
 
----- Original Message -----
Admittedly true. But notice, it starts with the assumption
that the language was phonetic. All I am doing is applying
the same assumption to Biblical Hebrew of 1000 BC or
older, not 600 AD after a millennium of frozen spelling,
language change and no native speakers.
 
We can't prove that it was phonetic, but modern practice
is equally unable to disprove that it was phonetic.
 
Further, the assumption that it was phonetic fits better all
the examples of alphabetic writing systems I have seen
where the spelling remained fluid, unlike modern
examples like English, French and Latin, where the
spelling is frozen to archaic forms while the spoken
language varies.