Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Jonathan Bailey <jonathan.bailey AT gmx.de>]

Rolf,

Is Kautsch/Gesenius-Bergsträsser considered outdated yet? It is still 
preached at my
school. I have never extensively worked with it, as I had already gotten W&O, 
and
KGB costs 248 DM new, and always over 150 DM in an antiquariat. My friend 
owns a
copy, though, and he is pretty impressed with it, though he is annoyed with 
the BH
Kittel variants and the like. Jenni seems too small.

I am wondering what the Germans are doing in the field of putting out 
grammars.
What are your thoughts?




"If there are many wisemen in a city, this means that the city will soon 
fall."
Babylonian proverb

Jonathan Bailey
Hochschule für Jüdische Studien
Heidelberg
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Column/9707/index.html
---------- Original Message ----------


>Dear Clay,


>Waltke/O'Connor is a superb work both regarding conclusions and the way
>these are presented to the readers. In the intermediate course of Hebrew in
>Oslo a thorough knowledge of this work and of Joüon/Muraoka is required.
>However, there are several shortcomings in Waltke/O´Connor, particularly in
>their presentation of the verbal conjugations (the presentation of the
>stems is excellent).

>S.R. Driver would translate the WAYYIQTOL ( 3.p.s ) of )MR as "and he
>proceded to say" rather than "and he said". In my view, Driver's solution
>is much better than the modern ones, and there are several other points
>where he presents his case better than modern authors. We cannot compare
>Charles and Driver, because we can really learn much from Driver in the
>year 2000.

>For a person who really wants to make an indepth study of Hebrew verbs, I
>would suggest the three primary steps to be:

>(1) Read "The Enigma of the Hebrew Verbal System", by  L. McFall and learn
>how impossible the modern view of WAYYIQTOL is.

>(2) Read S.R. Driver and make your own sketch of his model on a paper. Then
>test each major point against modern treatments. Before you reject a
>certain point, be sure that you *really* have good counterarguments.

>(3) Read Waltke/O´Connor and Joüon/Muraoka and see how their treatments of
>the verbs differ, and then start to make your own model. And, never accept
>the ad hominem argument "respected scholars have found...". Be critical and
>ask for data.



>Regards

>Rolf


>Rolf Furuli
>University of Oslo




>>Rolf,
>>
>>What your are saying is that S R Driver is generally wrong but you can
>>glean bits an pieces of worthwhile information from his book?  Is this
>>something like using R. H. Charles ICC commentary on the Apocalypse?
>>
>>I find your comment on Waltke/O'Connor troubling. I have been told by
>>numerous students of Waltke from the 70's that he was at that time
>>infallable :-)))). Now here you go casting doubts in my mind. It was
>>precisely because I own a copy of Waltke/O'Connor that I asked the
>>question to begin with.
>>
>>I will run right down to Half/Price books and pick up this tome. After
>>all what is $10? Not much risk.
>>
>>Thanks Rolf,
>>
>>Clay
>>
>>
>>
>>--
>>Clayton Stirling Bartholomew
>>Three Tree Point
>>P.O. Box 255 Seahurst WA 98062
>>
>>
>>----------
>>>From: Rolf Furuli <furuli AT online.no>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> It is definitely worth $ 10 if your purpose by acquiring it, is to learn
>>> something about Hebrew verbs. Vincent DeCaen (he is on the list) has shown
>>> that Driver was a much more original thinker than Waltke/O'Connor portrays
>>> him. While his model as a whole must be rejected, there are great amounts
>>> of insights in his book. If you work with the Hebrew verbal system, this 
>>> is
>>> a book you *must* have read.
>>
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