Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Ian Hutchesson <mc2499 AT mclink.it>]

At 07.00 27/01/00 +0200, John Ronning wrote:
>Peter Kirk wrote:
>> 
>> Dear John,
>> 
>> You seem to be equating Abraham's homeland, Ur Kasdim with the place
>> where Laban lives in Genesis 29:4.
>
>Abraham himself made the equation, 

No. The text itself maybe. But you are going beyond the data, for you just
have a narrative and no way of knowing any history behind it.

The text tells us incidentally that that home is in Aram Naharayim, ie the
Aram of the two rivers, or Mesopotamia proper, not the plain of Aram
(Paddan-Aram) up around Harran. Literal readings of diverse texts will
often get conflicting information.


Ian

>which is why I went to
>the trouble of quoting the verses. Once again,
>
>Gen 24:4 go to ***my country*** and to my relatives, and
>take a
>wife for my son Isaac.
>
>Where Abraham sent his servant is where Laban was living, in
>Aram-Nahariam.
>
>24:5 The servant asked him, "What if the woman is unwilling
>to come back with me to this land? Shall I then take your
>son back to ***the country you came from***?"
>
>24:7 "The Lord, the God of heaven, who brought me out of my
>father's household and ***my native land*** ['erets
>mowladti]...
>He will send his angel before you so that you can get a wife
>for my son ***from there***.[i.e. from my native land] =
>Ur-kasdim
>
>Compare 11:28 "Ur-Kasdim, the land of his birth" ['erets
>mowladto] (Abram's brother Haran).
>
>Very confusing directions and answers if Abraham came from
>600 miles away from where he sent his servant.
>
>> That verse strongly suggests that
>> Laban lives in Haran or its immediate vicinity, so close that
>> shepherds from Haran knew him and watered their sheep in the same
>> place. 
>
>Which is no doubt why Rebekah said to Jacob, "Flee to my
>brother Laban in Haran" (Gen 27:43).
>
>
>> Unfortunately for your theory, any suggestion that Ur was close
>> to Haran makes a complete nonsense of 11:31. 
>
>I suppose you are assuming there would be no need to
>"settle" [yashab, which I'm sure you'll agree can be a stay
>of a few hours] just down the road from where they set out. 
>But Gen 12:5 suggests the reason for stopping in Haran - to
>acquire goods and servants for the trip.  From which I would
>infer Ur-kasdim was a small city where they couldn't get
>what they needed, so they went to the big city, where they
>spent a bit of time trading before proceding on to their
>destination.
>
>It's proper procedure to interpret the unclear by the clear,
>not the other way around, and nothing could be clearer than
>that Abram's native land is Ur-kasdim, which in turn is
>clearly indicated to be near Haran, in Northern Mesopotamia.
>
>Yours,
>
>John Ronning
>
>
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