Biblical Hebrew Forum

[GregStffrd AT aol.com]

In a message dated 4/29/99 9:50:10 AM Pacific Daylight Time, 
churchyh AT ccwf.cc.utexas.edu writes:

<< 
 I may or may not read Buchanan's article (probably not within the next
 two weeks), but I don't need to for this limited purpose of deciding
 whether "Yahweh" sounds superficially Hebrew-ish.  If there was a root
 H-W-H, and it had a Hiph`il, then by regular rules of conjugation, its
 3rd masc.sg. imperfect would have the form "Yahweh"; furthermore,
 verbs conjugated in the 3rd masc.sg. imperfect are sometimes used as
 proper names in Hebrew (Yis.h.aq -- "Isaac").  Case closed (pretty
 much), and it doesn't really have anything to do with any particular
 passage of scripture. >>


Dear Henry:

It most certainly does in the context of Buchanan's study. I am surprised 
that you would even comment on his observation without recognizing the 
reference and context of his comments. 


<>


If you do not wish to discuss it, then why did you venture into the 
discussion of just such a topic, by introducing the issue of word-FINAL 
suffixes when Buchanan and I were referring to word-INITIAL elements and the 
middle vowel? 

What is so difficult about presenting evidence to contradict Buchanan's claim 
about compound names with word-initial yah- and the middle vowel, if it can 
be done? If not, then why discount the significance of the observation? 
Telling us what is subject to what without interacting with the specifics of 
the arguments, ultimately tells us little to nothing at all. 


> In some of the Hebrew personal names that incorporate a theophoric
> suffix, we find three different treatments of such names. First,
> there is the case where a theophoric suffix (for example, -yah
> [Hebrew YH] or -yahu [Hebrew YHW], instead of the full spelling
> [Hebrew YHWH], of course,) was sometimes entirely dropped.

<<Yes, and how does this show that -yah [with he mappiq] and -yahu are
not alternate short variants of the same full form (the
tetragrammaton)? >>


It does not. Apparently you did not gather that my observation (which is 
stated in clear terms) was in reference to the treatments of theophoric 
SUFFIXES that are in fact shortened at the END of such compounds, and this is 
meant to compliment Buchanan's/my observation regarding the word-initial yah- 
compounds, and the middle vowel. 

> the theophoric element could appear either as -yahu or as -yah. We
> transliterate (not to be confused with Anglicizing a Hebrew
> spelling) both the second and third treatments of the theophoric
> suffix as -iah.

<<"I" with a little half-circle dealy-bobber under it and "Y" are both
perfectly adequate transcriptions of the Hebrew letter Yodh in its
consonantal value, but there isn't very much point in mixing
transliterations -- and -YHW should _not_ be transcribed "-yah",
because of the letter Waw at the end. >>


Where do I say that it should? I am not referring to word-initial yhw- but to 
the suffix 
-yah or -yahu.


> Third, what evidence do you have that the "vowels points of 'Adonai'
> were added to the consonants of the Tetragrammaton"?

<<Look at the _Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia_ or any other standard
Hebrew Bible edition, and you'll see that usually the Yodh in YHWH has
a sh@wa under it, and the Waw has a qames. under it, where it was the
practice of the Jews to read the tetragrammaton aloud as "Adonai"; but
in some cases, the Waw has a h.ireq under it, in a few instances where
it was the practice of the Jews to read the tetragrammaton aloud as
"Elohim".  In many manuscripts (but apparently not according to the
best early masoretic practice), the first H also had a h.olem over it,
so that all the vowel points of "Adonai" were inserted into the
consonants of the tetragrammaton YHWH.  This was done according to the
well-known masoretic principle of Q're-K'tibh.  Reference:
_Introduction to the Tiberian Masorah_ by Israel Yeivin, translated by
E.J. Revell (1980), pp. 58-59. >>


This does not address my question. I know that this is the common belief of 
many, and it may be true, but I am asking you for evidence to support the 
claim. If such evidence from ancient sources is provided in Yeivin's work, 
then please cite it for us all.

Greg Stafford