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corpus-paul - RE: Paul's "dying for us" language

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  • From: Jim West <jwest AT highland.net>
  • To: Corpus-paul <corpus-paul AT franklin.oit.unc.edu>
  • Subject: RE: Paul's "dying for us" language
  • Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 21:52:16 -0500


At 08:22 PM 3/31/99 -0600, you wrote:

>{Jim}
>i will butt in here--- propitiation is wrong here as a translation- and
>leads to nothing but misunderstanding. expiation, and expiation alone will
>do.
>
>{Bill}
>Jim, you would have the agreement of the RSV. Others might disagree with
>you. "Mercy seat" would have way more support than "expiation" since the
>word in question is used to translate KAPPORETH 22 times in the Septuagint.

but the whole concept of the "hilasterion" is that of expiation and not
propitiation. It is an act of carrying away and not one of appeasing an
angry God who has to eat the sacrifice to survive.

>
>By the way, I think your authoritarian tone, void of anything other than
>your words as proof, and admitting to no possible alternate, is thoroughly
>inappropriate.

wow- i had no idea i was using an authoritarian tone. i certainly wasn't at
any rate. i was simply stating the case as i see it. the very idea of
propitiation is utterly foreign to hebrew theology- not to mention Paul's
own theology.

>
>But no matter:

indeed.

>
>If it is "mercy-seat," then Christ's blood is the atonement thereon;
>If it is "propitiation," then Christ is the satisfaction of the public sense
>of justice;
>If it is "expiation" [which I personally find weak], then Christ is the
>basis of our forgiveness.

it is in fact the latter choice, which you deem the weakest, that is most in
line with the overall thinking of paul, and for that matter, the author of
hebrews and the various writers of the catholic epistles. take a look at
Bultmann's Theology of the NT. Further, see Adolf Schlatter's "Der Glaube
im NT". Likewise, take a look at Kasemann's "Romans". Finally, read Jurgen
Becker's "Paul".

best,

jim
(speaking ex cathedra)

;-)
+++++++++++++++++++++++++

Jim West, ThD
Petros Baptist Church- Pastor
Quartz Hill School of Theology- Adjunct Prof. of Bible

fax- 978-231-5986
email- jwest AT highland.net
web page- http://web.infoave.net/~jwest





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