permaculture

[Daniel Jager <dfjager@yahoo.com>]

It is my experience that most 'fire-prone' landscapes would see nearly a 90% 
reduction in fire frequency... if MAN was taken out of the equation.

I have seen this with 'natural fires" in the forests of Finland and Russia. 
Upon closer investigation most of these fires were actually lit, even in very 
dry years.
And isn't it amazing how much broken glasses and discarded beer bottles can 
be found along-side roads and near habitation in semi-arid regions with 
steppe-like vegetation?

And on the Fukuoka farming lists there are some examples of people who had 
their farms torched in India by neighbors... for those neighbors believed 
that all that mulch attracted pests to the neighboring farms... And yet, 
miraculously, all that mulch, even under 8 months of dry season with daily 
temp. at 30 Celsius or above, never 'spontaneously' caught fire in previous 
years.

Hope these examples help any discussion. In my opinion: Education is the 
key... Or the building of very high concrete walls.

Daniel



>Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 18:39:43 +0100
>From: joao pedro goncalves <joaovox@gmail.com>
>Subject: [permaculture] 1st Cycle of Meetings "Edible landscapes -
>    Food forests and Agro-forestry in Fire-prone Landscape"
>
>http://permaculturaportugal.ning.com/events/florestas-de-alimentos-e-agro-florestas-em-zonas-de-inc-ndio
>
>O qu?/What:
>
>1? Ciclo de Encontros "Ambientes comest?veis - Florestas de Alimentos
>e Agro-florestas em Zonas de Inc?ndio" em Ch?o Sobral
>Cada encontro ? independente do anterior ou pr?ximo.
>O programa ? co-criado pelos participantes e vai ser em detalhe
>adaptado aos interesses e perguntas dos participantes de cada
>encontro.
>
>
>1st Cycle of Meetings "Edible landscapes - Food forests and
>Agro-forestry in Fire-prone Landscape" in Ch?o Sobral
>Each meeting is co-created by all participants and is independant from
>previous or next meetings.
>Interests and questions of each participant will be addressed in detail.
>
>Porqu? / Why:
>"Porque vivemos num barril de p?lvora ... " e precisamos testar
>pr?ticas, gerar conhecimento e entender as diferentes maneiras de
>lidar com o nosso ecossistema, reduzindo o potencial destrutivo do
>fogo e gerando economia, servi?os ecol?gicos e sa?de.
>"Because we live in a gunpowder barrel ... " and we need to test
>practices, enacting knowledge and understand the different ways to
>deal with our ecosystem, reducing the destructive fire hazard and
>generating economy, ecological services and health.
>http://chaosobral.org/incendio.htm
>http://florestaparasempre.no.sapo.pt/19jul001.htm
>
>Como/How:
>Visitas de estudo guiadas a zonas de inc?ndio, ambientes comest?veis e
>sistemas agro-florestais locais
>Apresenta??es e oficinas tem?ticas
>Actividades pr?ticas agro-florestais e florestais para apoiar projetos locais
>
>Guided study tours through fire-prone landscapes, edible landscapes
>and agroforestry systems
>Presentations and workshops
>Agro-forestry and forestry hands-on activities to support local projects
>
>
>Quando/When:
>
>S?bados / Saturdays - 25 Maio/ May, 1, 8, 15 e 22 de Junho / June 2013
>9h-17h com intervalo para almo?o.
>
>Onde/Where:
>
>Ch?o Sobral - Serra do A?or - Freguesia de Aldeia das Dez - Concelho
>de Oliveira do Hospital - Distrito de Coimbra - Portugal
>
>Organizado por Jo?o Gon?alves - Terras Altas - Permacultura Aldeia Pedag?gica
>Organised by Jo?o Gon?alves - Terras Altas - Permaculture Learning Village
>
>
>
>-- 
>Jo?o Gon?alves
>
>"Permacultura (Cultura Permanente) ? um sistema ?tico de design ecol?gico."
>
>(+351) 96 96 80 009
>Ch?o Sobral - Oliveira do Hospital - Serra do A?or
>
>http://permacultureglobal.com/users/902-joao-goncalves
>http://chaosobral.org/index_pt.htm
>http://agricultura-familiar-tradicional.blogspot.pt/
>https://picasaweb.google.com/joaovox
>http://picasaweb.google.pt/uniprochaosobral
>http://picasaweb.google.pt/festerrar
>Visite
>Permacultura na Serra do A?or - Portugal
>http://permaculturinginportugal.net/blog/
>"Comida que nunca acaba" / Permacultura no Malawi
>http://www.neverendingfood.org/
>Centro de Ecologia Integral
>http://www.integralecology.org
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 15:52:01 -0400
>From: venaurafarm <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
>Subject: [permaculture] Fwd: Help with planning a farmers market lab?
>To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
>Message-ID: <519A7EE1.80801@bellsouth.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
>
>
>
>-------- Original Message --------
>Subject: Help with planning a farmers market lab?
>Date:     Mon, 20 May 2013 12:57:34 -0400
>From:     Richard Moyer <ramoyer@gmail.com>
>
>
>How would you recommend helping students understand where food comes from?
>
>Am teaching an online course this summer.  Including labs.  One lab goes 
>along with class concepts of carbon cycles, foodsheds, watersheds, food 
>webs, etc.  And with human microbiomes and how to nourish them (see 
>Michael Pollan's article at NYT Magazine.)
>
>Here's the lab draft, please comment and help me improve:
>1)  Visit one or more local farmers markets (this will be in July.)
>   Photodocument (with permission) the variety of foods available.
>   Compare prices with a local supermarket (excluding sale items).
>
>2)  Goal is to buy, locally, all the primary ingredients for the
>complete meal, from the one(s) who grew the foods.  Take pics (with
>permission) of the foods and the growers.  Ask for recipes.
>
>3)  During purchase, ask farmer/grower if they could please share why
>they grow and why they sell direct to consumers.  If they are still
>willing to talk, ask farmer/grower where the crop nutrients
>(fertilizers, etc) come from, and what they depend on for water.
>
>4)  Cook this locally purchased meal and share it with at least one
>other.  (Been doing this part for years, as an in class activity with a
>single food at a time.)
>
>5)  Reflect, with writing, pics, narrative, etc, on the experience of
>sourcing a local meal.  Would you be willing to do this more often?
>   Explain reasons why/why not.
>
>Suggest changes to any or all of the above.  Again, goal is to help
>students connect with the abstract concepts of foodsheds, watersheds,
>food webs, and to experience a single supply line: one grower to one eater.
>
>Thanks for any and all feedback!
>Richard Moyer
>Castlewood, VA
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 16:10:54 -0400
>From: venaurafarm <venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>
>Subject: Re: [permaculture] CEC, Biochar and Soil Remineralization
>    with quarry rock dusts. | an interesting and useful reply
>To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
>Message-ID: <519A834E.7080507@bellsouth.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
>
>
>On 5/19/2013 3:13 PM, Lawrence F. London, Jr. wrote:
>>
>> Michael Astera of http://soilminerals.com writes:
>>> How does one "build good soils"? Serious question.
>>>
>>> I frequently see soil test reports with a CEC below 7meq. A CEC of 7 is
>>> necessary in order to hold onto sufficient Ca, Mg, and K to provide
>>> minimum optimal levels of those minerals (minimums would be 750 ppm Ca,
>>> 100 ppm Mg, 100 ppm K). Those amounts need to be there even if the soil
>>> can't hold onto them. If they are added for the growing season and the
>>> soil can't hold them what the plants don't take up will likely by washed
>>> away by precipitation and irrigation.
>>>
>>> How to build CEC? By adding or growing large quantities of organic
>>> matter, or high CEC clay, or humate ore, or biochar. Adding enough
>>> compost may or may not be practical, and in a hot climate may not be
>>> do-able at all. High CEC clay is heavy, and the best, Calcium Bentonite,
>>> is expensive and hard to find. Humate ore is expensive and can only be
>>> used in small quantities. Biochar is often the most practical answer if
>>> it can be obtained or made at a reasonable cost.
>>
>> Rock dusts & CEC:
>>
>> Apart from remineralizing your soil would CEC be improved with
>> application of large (medium or small) quantities of non toxic,
>> environmentally clean, rock dusts from quarries, i.e. siltation pond
>> fines? Reading the MSDS freely supplied by each rock quarry would tell
>> you the array of minerals in their product and the percentage of each
>> one. You could then decide which fines you want to use and how much you
>> want to apply. The material is usually free; you pay for trucking or
>> haul it yourself. Rent a skid loader for 4 hours and spread it out on
>> your fields or gardens when soil is not moist or wet, i.e. very dry, to
>> reduce compaction from loader or truck. These quarries are under close
>> scrutiny by the EPA because the large water flow from the siltation
>> ponds affects the local watershed, ecosystems, streams, rivers and
>> creeks. I have two piles of dust at the edge of my field to use in top
>> dressing or making potting soil. Rainfall has washed small amounts o
>> these powders, pyrophyllite and granite, across my lawn and dirt
>> driveway. Grass and white and red clover growth in these areas is
>> incredible, never before seen, especially the white clover. Melilotus
>> alba or tall white sweet clover has also benefited from the rock dusts.
>> Every deciduous hardwood tree seed that falls on this land seems to
>> sprout and grow at a record rate. Using a skid loader I mixed clean,
>> aged, black, natural cow straw manure with equal amounts of a mix of
>> quarry rock dusts, a small proportion of bagged and bulk mineral
>> amendments (idaho rock phosphate, tennesee rock phosphate, florida
>> colloidal and rock phosphate, greensand, azomite) then applied to areas
>> where I wanted to establish gardens. I have photos of all this inluding
>> pix of farm implements used. BTW a Yeomans keyline plow is a must have
>> for a small farm. This was an expensive project that I could only afford
>> to do once in a lifetime so I laid down a lot of materials and a lot of
>> intensive, deep tillage, created a lot of tall wide raised garden beds,
>> sold off all the equipment and now only use no or minimum till garden
>> methods and top dress as needed to maintain soil fertility with compost
>> made from weeds in the gardens, bagged chicken manure, granulated
>> seaweed, rock phosphate, azomite and greensand.
>
>Michael Astera of http://soilminerals.com replies to my question:
>
>"It sounds like you did a wonderful job of mineralizing your soil, but 
>what you added won't necessarily add CEC.
>
>Exchange capacity is the ability of components of the soil to hold onto 
>minerals via a static electrical charge. A soil particle with a positive 
>+ charge can hold a negative ion (an anion) like NO3- nitrate; a 
>negative - charge can hold a positive ion (a cation) like K+, Potassium. See
>http://soilminerals.com/Cation_Exchange_Simplified.htm
>
>Soil components with high CEC, cation exchange capacity, include some 
>clays, humus and humate ore, and charcoal. Humus, humates, and charcoal 
>also have significant AEC, anion exchange capacity. (AEC is not usually 
>measured on soil tests.)
>
>Rock dusts generally have little or no exchange capacity because they 
>don't have significant static electrical charge. Florida soft rock 
>phosphate is an exception, because it contains a good amount of high-CEC 
>clay. Limestone powder, Calcium carbonate, has effectively zero exchange 
>capacity; ditto for basalt, granite, etc no matter how small the particles.
>
>Adding fresh rock dusts can easily skew a soil test to read too high in 
>exchange capacity because Ca, Mg, K, Na etc will be etched from the rock 
>particles, rather than only from exchange sites. One can tell if they 
>are likely to have that problem by pouring vinegar on a dry soil sample; 
>if it fizzes considerably that means high levels of freely available 
>cations, especially Calcium.
>
>The best way to find out the actual CEC of the soil would be to test a 
>sample that has not been amended with rock dust."
>
>Michael A
>http://soilminerals.com
>
>> Biochar:
>>
>> My experience with applying charcoal from my outdoor wood fired cook
>> stove/water heater was very good. The particles ranged in size from dust
>> to 1" chunks plus a little ashes. I spread the charcoal over an
>> adjoining weedy area. Plant growth there has been phenomenal for the
>> past 5 years.
>>
>> If there is a way to make large quantities of biochar using readily
>> available biomass,, tree trimmings, etc., i.e. materials on site,
>> without generating more than a minimum of creosote-laden smoke, then
>> this should become a standard gardening procedure to follow when
>> materials need to be recycled and soil amendments are needed. Biomass
>> and tree trimming could be divided between biochar production,
>> Hugelkulture mound gardens and compost making. I assume that there is a
>> near pollution-free method of making biochar that mostly exudes steam;
>> anyway it should be possible with the right equipment configured and
>> operated properly.
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 14:50:45 -0700
>From: Alia Tsang <alia@dietrick.org>
>Subject: Re: [permaculture] Fwd: Help with planning a farmers market
>    lab?
>To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
>Cc: ramoyer@gmail.com
>Message-ID:
>    <CAGqUf6V5K1MzvXp3BQV1=eO305__yOEoNr+VwgaJ1jys6y+YZQ@mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>I have a friend that teaches a course that includes trips to the farmer's
>market. One thing that surprised her was the amount of students who had
>never seen a persimmon before (I think she said one thought they were bad
>tomatoes). An interesting question to include could be along the lines of
>"Are there any fruits/vegetables you've never seen before?" And maybe an
>encouragement to try said alien produce. Also, to add to the price
>comparison question, where (what country/how far away) is the supermarket
>produce from?
>
>Alia
>
>On Mon, May 20, 2013 at 12:52 PM, venaurafarm 
><venaurafarm@bellsouth.net>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: Help with planning a farmers market lab?
>> Date:   Mon, 20 May 2013 12:57:34 -0400
>> From:   Richard Moyer <ramoyer@gmail.com>
>>
>>
>> How would you recommend helping students understand where food comes from?
>>
>> Am teaching an online course this summer.  Including labs.  One lab goes
>> along with class concepts of carbon cycles, foodsheds, watersheds, food
>> webs, etc.  And with human microbiomes and how to nourish them (see
>> Michael Pollan's article at NYT Magazine.)
>>
>> Here's the lab draft, please comment and help me improve:
>> 1)  Visit one or more local farmers markets (this will be in July.)
>>    Photodocument (with permission) the variety of foods available.
>>    Compare prices with a local supermarket (excluding sale items).
>>
>> 2)  Goal is to buy, locally, all the primary ingredients for the
>> complete meal, from the one(s) who grew the foods.  Take pics (with
>> permission) of the foods and the growers.  Ask for recipes.
>>
>> 3)  During purchase, ask farmer/grower if they could please share why
>> they grow and why they sell direct to consumers.  If they are still
>> willing to talk, ask farmer/grower where the crop nutrients
>> (fertilizers, etc) come from, and what they depend on for water.
>>
>> 4)  Cook this locally purchased meal and share it with at least one
>> other.  (Been doing this part for years, as an in class activity with a
>> single food at a time.)
>>
>> 5)  Reflect, with writing, pics, narrative, etc, on the experience of
>> sourcing a local meal.  Would you be willing to do this more often?
>>    Explain reasons why/why not.
>>
>> Suggest changes to any or all of the above.  Again, goal is to help
>> students connect with the abstract concepts of foodsheds, watersheds,
>> food webs, and to experience a single supply line: one grower to one eater.
>>
>> Thanks for any and all feedback!
>> Richard Moyer
>> Castlewood, VA
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> permaculture mailing list
>> permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>> subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list
>> maintenance:
>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
>> message archives:  http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture/
>> Google message archive search:
>> site: lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/permaculture [searchstring]
>> Permaculture Institute USA http://permaculture.org
>> Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
>>
>>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 19:24:10 -0400
>From: Lawrence London <lfljvenaura@gmail.com>
>Subject: [permaculture] CEC, increasing CEC,    rock dusts and OM - lots
>    of images
>To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
>Message-ID:
>    <CA+j2Q+A1Qp9n6cu2=v8T6p0WcEjs5_ZeU0WB_2NqSt4Jkp14Nw@mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>On 5/20/2013 3:36 PM, m_astera wrote:
>
>ecolandtech <dirt.4arm@...> wrote:
>> It sounds like you did a wonderful job of mineralizing your soil, but
>> what you added won't necessarily add CEC.
>>
>> Exchange capacity is the ability of components of the soil to hold onto
>> minerals via a static electrical charge. A soil particle with a positive
>> + charge can hold a negative ion (an anion) like NO3- nitrate; a
>> negative - charge can hold a positive ion (a cation) like K+, Potassium.
>> See
>> http://soilminerals.com/**Cation_Exchange_Simplified.htm<http://soilminerals.com/Cation_Exchange_Simplified.htm>
>>
>> Soil components with high CEC, cation exchange capacity, include some
>> clays, humus and humate ore, and charcoal. Humus, humates, and charcoal
>> also have significant AEC, anion exchange capacity. (AEC is not usually
>> measured on soil tests.)
>>
>> Rock dusts generally have little or no exchange capacity because they
>> don't have significant static electrical charge. Florida soft rock
>> phosphate is an exception, because it contains a good amount of high-CEC
>> clay. Limestone powder, Calcium carbonate, has effectively zero exchange
>> capacity; ditto for basalt, granite, etc no matter how small the particles.
>>
>> Adding fresh rock dusts can easily skew a soil test to read too high in
>> exchange capacity because Ca, Mg, K, Na etc will be etched from the rock
>> particles, rather than only from exchange sites. One can tell if they
>> are likely to have that problem by pouring vinegar on a dry soil sample;
>> if it fizzes considerably that means high levels of freely available
>> cations, especially Calcium.
>>
>> The best way to find out the actual CEC of the soil would be to test a
>> sample that has not been amended with rock dust.
>>
>> Michael A
>> http://soilminerals.com
>>
>
>Thanks very much for your helpful and informative reply, Michael. This
>certainly explains much of what CEC and AEC are all about. I will read
>your page on this topic and in time will buy a copy of your book.
>
>My thoughts:
>I can see that the quarry rock dusts won't improve my soil's CEC but it
>will feed the soil microbes, weeds and crops growing in it. The weeds
>can be turned under thus returning nutrients to the soil and adding OM
>which may increase CEC on its own.
>
>My soil is Georgeville silt loam. It is bright red, high in iron and is
>exactly the same consistency and color (except for topsoil on or near
>the surface) 3 to 6 feet down where you encounter parent material which
>is lighter colored and larger particle size, like a very fine sand,
>which blends with eroded fractured pieces of bedrock (where the parent
>soil originated) and below that partially eroded bedrock, a kind of
>bluestone used to make crushed rock for roads, second hardest rock in
>North Carolina.
>
>GnC?Georgeville-Urban land complex, 2 to 10 percent
>slopes
>http://soildatamart.nrcs.usda.**gov/Manuscripts/NC037/0/**Chatham.pdf<http://soildatamart.nrcs.usda.gov/Manuscripts/NC037/0/Chatham.pdf>
>
>Fundamentals of Soil Cation Exchange Capacity (CEC)
>http://www.extension.purdue.**edu/extmedia/ay/ay-238.html<http://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/ay/ay-238.html>
>Table 1. Normal Range of CEC Values for Common Color/Texture Soil Groups.
>   Soil groups              Examples      CEC in meg/100g
>------------------------------**--------------------------
>Light colored loams and   Clermont-Miami   10-20
>  silt loams               Miami
>Dark colored loams and    Sidell           15-25
>  silt loams               Gennesee
>
>My goal was to turn red dirt into tan or brown garden soil to as great a
>depth as I could afford given the resources I had at the time. I
>accomplished this.
>
>Higher CEC is what I need now as my garden beds have gained a fair
>amount of compaction with resulting loss of water holding capacity and
>plant growth. Over the three years spent on this soil building program I
>blended, spread and tilled hundreds of tons of manures and rock dusts
>(four kinds, from four different quarries) on 5 acres of land then ended
>my project and sold the equipment. I now have a jungle of dense tall
>weeds in the fields, more this year than ever before. I can confidently
>say that Fukuoka was right.
>
>Here are galleries of pictures of the project:
>Preparation:
>1)
>https://plus.google.com/b/**106181639516457096425/photos/**
>106181639516457096425/albums/**5873426643820858097<https://plus.google.com/b/106181639516457096425/photos/106181639516457096425/albums/5873426643820858097>
>2)
>https://plus.google.com/b/**106181639516457096425/photos/**
>106181639516457096425/albums/**5873409948529968017<https://plus.google.com/b/106181639516457096425/photos/106181639516457096425/albums/5873409948529968017>
>
>Preparation & Equipment
>3)
>http://www.ibiblio.org/london/**venaurafarm/raisedbeds/<http://www.ibiblio.org/london/venaurafarm/raisedbeds/>
>For tool, implement and tractor nuts, the most useful pictures of my
>tractor and IMO world class implements. See especially:
>Equipment, Ponds, Bed Preparation
>Roll-A-Cone-Hiller-Bedder
>HowardRotavator-50inch
>Howard Rotavator
>YeomansPlowToolbar
>bottomplow-tillagetool-**YeomansPlowToolbar
>Yeomans Plow 1
>Yeomans Plow 2
>Yeomans Plow 3
>Yeomans plow 4
>Yeomans plow 5
>Yeomans plow in use
>hiller-bedder-1
>hiller-bedder-2
>hiller-bedder-3
>hiller-bedder-4
>hiller-bedder-5
>hilling-bedding1
>hilling-bedding2
>hilling-bedding3
>hilling-bedding4
>
>Fields:
>4)
>https://plus.google.com/b/**106181639516457096425/photos/**
>106181639516457096425/albums/**5871242339766436321<https://plus.google.com/b/106181639516457096425/photos/106181639516457096425/albums/5871242339766436321>
>5)
>https://plus.google.com/b/**106181639516457096425/photos/**
>106181639516457096425/albums/**5871242339766436321<https://plus.google.com/b/106181639516457096425/photos/106181639516457096425/albums/5871242339766436321>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>permaculture mailing list
>permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
>subscribe/unsubscribe|user config|list info|make a donation toward list 
>maintenance:
>http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture
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>Avant Geared  http://www.avantgeared.com
>
>End of permaculture Digest, Vol 124, Issue 22
>*********************************************
>
>
>
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Date: Thu, 23 May 2013 00:08:08 -0400
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Subject: [permaculture] internship position available at Three Sisters Farm
        and Bioshelter
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 Greetings ,

 We atill have an internship position available at Three Sisters Farm. This 
is an intensive market garden and permaculture farm projects internship. June 
through September.
For details email  Darrell Frey at          
threesisters@bioshelter.com

Thanks,
Darrell

Darrell E. Frey
Three Sisters Farm
defrey@bioshelter.com
www.bioshelter.com

Author; Bioshelter Market Garden: A Permaculture Farm. New Society 
Publishing, 2011