permaculture

[jacque greenleaf <jacque_greenleaf@yahoo.com>]

So that adds another question to this topic - what makes it sprout like mad? 
In a nearby town there's a house and lot that look like something in a horror 
movie because of the intensive sprouting. Some of these sprouts are over 20 
feet high, and the house is uninhabitable. Yet there are many perfectly 
behaved black locust trees in that same neighborhood.

--- On Mon, 8/25/08, Margaret L. Wilson <booldawgs@frontiernet.net> wrote:
From: Margaret L. Wilson <booldawgs@frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] what makes black locust last so long?
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Monday, August 25, 2008, 12:02 PM

I have black locust taking over my yard.  It has sprung up under the house, 
invaded water, leach and septic lines.  It was in the yard when we bought 
the property.   I would be careful planting it as a border.
Margaret
http://farfarawayfarm.blogspot.com/
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "paul wheaton" <paul@richsoil.com>
To: "permaculture" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, August 25, 2008 10:59 AM
Subject: [permaculture] what makes black locust last so long?


>I have asked this question about 20 times in all sorts of different
> places.  Any time anybody seems like they might possibly know ...
>
> So I ask it again here.
>
> In case nobody knows, I hope that somebody might carry this question
> with them and maybe some day spot an answer.
>
> So we know that black locust wood lasts a long time.  Old time farmers
> would call it "stone wood" claiming that it would last longer
than
> stones when used as fence posts.
>
> Why?  Does it have some anti-fungal property?  Anti-microbial?  I've
> heard some people say something about it could be because it is just
> so dense - but that doesn't seem right either.  Other dense woods seem
> to decompose fairly rapidly.
>
> Would it be less than wise to use black locust as a garden border
> because of some alelopathic effect as it decomposes?  Or would it
> somehow make an excellent garden border because it will last 30 years,
> and what little of it that does rot will pass on the n-fixing it did
> when it was alive.
>
> I've been trying to get an answer to this question for three years ...
> maybe I'm asking it wrong, or researching it wrong ... or something
> ...
>
> Help!
> _______________________________________________
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>
> 

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Subject: Re: [permaculture] what makes black locust last so long?
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http://www.lib.ncsu.edu/theses/available/etd-11242003-154755/unrestricted/etd.pdf

2.4 Secondary Metabolites of Black Locust and Effect on Animals
As mentioned previously, the heartwood of BL is primarily used for fence 
posts,
poles, railroad ties, and mine timbers and can endure for over 100 years in 
the soil. Its
remarkable decay resistance is due to high flavonoid concentrations (6% of 
dry 
weight),
specifically the constituents, robtin (15,000 ppm), robinetin (20,000 to 
80,000 ppm) and
dihydrorobinetin (53,000 to 176,000 ppm)(Smith et al., 1989). Other, 
flavonoids present in
the heartwood are butein, butin, fisetin, fustin, and liquiritigenin (Duke, 
2000)

On Monday 25 August 2008 12:59:21 pm paul wheaton wrote:
> I have asked this question about 20 times in all sorts of different
> places.  Any time anybody seems like they might possibly know ...
>
> So I ask it again here.
>
> In case nobody knows, I hope that somebody might carry this question
> with them and maybe some day spot an answer.
>
> So we know that black locust wood lasts a long time.  Old time farmers
> would call it "stone wood" claiming that it would last longer than
> stones when used as fence posts.
>
> Why?  Does it have some anti-fungal property?  Anti-microbial?  I've
> heard some people say something about it could be because it is just
> so dense - but that doesn't seem right either.  Other dense woods seem
> to decompose fairly rapidly.
>