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  • From: "Vital Scherrer" <vital233@hotmail.com>
  • To: permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [permaculture] Similarities between the Jesus Movement atitsorigin and the P
  • Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 12:26:38 +0000

Tommy,

Well said!
Thanks for disclosing this part of your life, which turned out so wonderfully! - Such stories are among my favorites. You gave me the best Christmas present that I got. (Sorry if that sounds too sentimental - poor intellectual hardliners!) - You and your soulmate must be a couple in a million, to say the least! - I don't suppose she would by any chance happen to have a close friend who is looking for a soulmate too :-). I'm looking for one for almost forty years now, and never even came close. I guess I have got to have at least reasonable grief skills too; which other choices do I have. But, never mind...join the club! (Sorry, I was just talking to myself.)

I hope this is not definitely too much off the thread, or even off the list :-). - I wonder, as you appear to be on an advanced stage, how you feel about Greg's statement:
"The real thing is never as good as the fantasy."
You might give some advice.

For my part I would say that I had a few experiences, which were better than the fantasy. But then again, my fantasy may not be that good anyway :-). I mean, I can't even imagine what you're experiencing.

By the way, I didn't know there existed a Tantra DVD. - Folks, forget about porn :-). (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

"In the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make."

That is true, probably even more so with non sex related love.
...Or, also in this context:
"Life's a game of give and take!" (The band Santana sang that.) - I guess that's called Karma too.

I consider myself an agnostic, but if somebody would ask me which beliefs I cherish, I would have to say - of course apart from the power of love:
- After all, there exists a balance in this world, not just through the physical laws,
- to be honest with others and especially oneself is a precondition for development and improvement,
- and there is a lot more to life than meets the eye, and thats why by thinking positive things will and have been made happen, which most would never even have been able to imagine.

I sure wish you two the best with your marriage! Though it sounds like you "a hoot in Hell" don't need it :-) (meaning my wishes for your marriage). I wish I could be at your wedding. But don't worry, I won't make it :-).

To the followers of the sexual abstinence I would like to add, that it is a noble trait to cherish life's most precious gifts, but its another thing if some people grow up suffering in a social background where people foster high expectations, which are unrealistic and therefore can't be met. After all its neither healthy nor productive to overrate things, and sex is at heart just an innocent, primal and natural activity - it is God's gift and if we deal with it commonsensibly, it's certainly contradictory to be ashamed of it.


But what about the "Similarities between the Jesus Movement at its origin and the Permaculture movement"? I guess that's mainly about the struggle and how we can make the breakthrough. I'm afraid before something new can take place, something old must be shattered and reach the end of the line, or in other words, the anti-nature-bubble must burst. Thats what usually happened in history in such cases. Lets give the best example that we can and let as many people know about it, throw light at the nuisances, including the subtle ones, including doctrinal beliefs and -faiths and other superstitions, and straighten things out.

Viva Mother Nature!

Vital


----Original Message Follows----
From: "Healing Hawk" <healinghawk@earthlink.net>
Reply-To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
To: "'permaculture'" <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: Re: [permaculture]

Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2007 14:57:48 -0600

Just before I left California, I met a woman and we fell in love. It turned
out that she was a Tantra teacher. Sex occurred in sacred space. We were
sacred beings expressing our love for each other in this sacred space. I
experienced what I know as God in having the god she saw in me worshipped by
her and in worshipping the goddess I saw in her. Each one of these
experiences totally transcended the one before. We still called it sex, but
it was so much more that calling it sex bordered on the sacrilegious.

But then she expressed a desire to have the cats who live with me to live
outside. The cats stayed. The Tantra teacher didn't. I found it hugely
disappointing, but I have good grief skills. We still have e-mail contact
from time to time and I still think she's a terrific, sacred being. I just
refuse to live with anyone who can't live with the cats who live with me.
I've never given up a pet in my life, but I've given up lots of lovers and
one wife for one reason or another in the process of getting here.

In Austin, I had the wonderful fortune last December of meeting a soulmate,
surely the love of my life, who dotes on the cats who live with her. She's
finishing up grad school at an Austin seminary. Her father was a Methodist
minister. I experience God each time we make love and so does she. It's so
real we cry. It's very different than with the Tantra teacher. I'm not
being taught and directed, for one thing, nor am I teaching or directing.
We both own a copy of Margo Anand's "The Art of Sexual Ecstasy," though.

We're getting married on January 6, and we're taking a Tantra DVD with us on
our honeymoon in a cabin beyond cell phone service in the wilderness of a
Texas ranch.

In the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make. The Beatles
said that, and it's true for me. I don't give a hoot in Hell if anyone else
thinks so or not. I'm not into preaching my way. But if you get the book
and try it . . .

Tommy Tolson
Austin, TX

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  • Re: [permaculture] Similarities between the Jesus Movement atitsorigin and the P, Vital Scherrer, 12/29/2007

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