permaculture

["Marsha Hanzi" <hanzibra@svn.com.br>]

Thank you Arina, for the iinformation.

 

In fact, I am not thinking of chicken tractor situations a such, but an agroforest situation integrated with annual crops , but  aiming at more comfort and space than I understand a chicken tractor to have...Maybe I am still aiming too low.

 

The  limiting factor here is fencing, which is very expensive...I have not yet found a way to fence in chickens in a really effective way, although we have some native bromelias in view which may be  reliable for this.

 

I have seen such systems where the chickens have plenty of habitats because of the agroforest situation, and where there  is an abundance of earthworms ( which is the main motive here, to eliminate the cost of purchased  feed, growing corn locally) in a rotational system.  What I am trying to do now is  increase the scale of such successful small-scale systems , to make them commercial instead of the horrors  of commercial egg systems we see today.  Even the commercial "organic" systems only offer bits of grass to them here- we are proposing to create systems rich enough in variety that the chicken can fulfill most of its needs, with the exception of some grain...

 

If you read my post a bit more carefully, what I am proposing is a total area of 17 ( 8 pens of 2 meters, and one central pen of 1 meter) square meters per head, which I consider to be quite generous.  

 

We have to be practical with what these systems cost, as I am proposing this to farmers who today have poorly-managed freerange flocks who lay eggs God knows where, dry up the land by excessive scratching, and are  very subject to predators due to lack of protection, which would be provided by the fencing, in the case of the main predator here...

 

Marsha

----- Original Message -----

From: Scott Pittman

To: permaculture

Sent: Friday, August 04, 2000 6:40 PM

Subject: Re: chicken forage --territory (long)

I have observed, however, that in many of the existing systems I have seen, the chickens tend to hang around the hen house, digging holes in the soil, than to use the whole area.  I remember that my free-ranging chickens had a definite territory, and wonder if this is the case.  The other possibility  is that in the existing systems,  low grass has been planted, and the chickens seem loath to venture into it ( as it is higher than they are), preferring to eat it away at the edges. Fear of predators hidden in the grass? (in this case, snakes...)

My layers, that are free ranging all year except early spring, are attached to their house and refused to stay in a tractor even in the most delicious area. Our solution  was to create a bigger (1000 sq. feet) movable pen, that was attached to the chicken house, and that was moved around as needed ( it consisted of t-posts and deer net). We discovered that we needed a cover over it so chicken would not fly out. In general this system was less elegant, harder to deal with, unattractive, than tractors or free range.
My experience in both high desert and in tropics is that free range chickens are much more happy and effective for bug control, given that they are not allowed to overpopulate or get in the annual gardens. Chicken tractor is a tool of increasing soil fertility, not a way of keeping chickens, I believe.
I use tractor selectively, when I need help over a certain area, and let chickens out every evening for at least one hour. By sunset they go back to their chicken house.
At our place I see chickens visit about 4 acre territory, that is mostly shaded and has established ground covers. They especially prefer what has been an inspiration for my chicken forest - a grove of native plum shrubs, that have low branches, shade, and many safe and discreet places under it.  I think any commercial operation must think about creating natural habitat conditions, and it can include appropriate fruit trees or shrubs, where birds can behave naturally. I have a friend, David Trew, who teaches Animal Systems in Permaculture, and has lifetime of experience with all sorts of domestic animals, and he believes that normal behavior is critical for successful husbandry. A chicken tractor does not really promote normal behavior,  unless is big enough and placed in conditions that will replicate habitat, and that includes trees.
An example of dysfunctional chicken house is luck of setting instinct, and thus luck of chicks; egg eating; pecking; boycotting a member; physical illnesses.

As I am now adapting these smaller backyard systems to larger commercial systems, I am looking for some clear data or personal experiences on this, because my doubt is , if we have more heads and a larger area, will they actually and effectively occupy this whole area, or just pile up ( as I have seen until now) near the henhouse, and leave the edges of the pens  untouched..

When we used larger movable pens we never had this problem, unless there was a smaller area "behind the corner" where birds had to make a turn and lose contact with their mates. We also encouraged them to go to unfavored spots by throwing kitchen scraps there. In general they would retrieve to the chicken house in the hottest hours of the day (it is shady by our ch. house), and for dust bathing - the rest of the space has ground covers, and better soils, that is hard to bathe in.

As far as numbers go, I heard people manage to staff their tractors pretty full, like 300 sq. foot contained 60 chickens. The soil was just fine with 1 day rotation schedule ( do not know about resting time). But if the whole thing is about raising / keeping animals with respect, I do not think these numbers will provide a bird with a happy life. Tractoring is an unnatural thing, as in no natural condition a bird will scratch, poop and eat over the same spot for many days , as well as it never will agree to have no privacy from other birds. Tractors can be used in situations of intensive agriculture to replenish fertility, but then their poop also creates health hazards, I would think. In state of New Mexico the organic growers cannot fertilize crops with uncomposted manure, unless it goes through winter.

Energy wise for me it was simpler to create a habitat, so I do not have to move tractor, water and food around, worry about numbers and crops, but let them decide what they want/need today, and how much. The territory at large must be secured/fenced in, of course, and then no need to worry about rotation schedule etc. I might be wrong, but rotation was first developed for cattle, as without predators they behave very differently - they get scattered around and walk slowly, rather than moving fast in a large group, making a quick impact on a territory and leaving it behind. Birds, on opposite, normally will roam loosely, moving fast from spot to spot, without impacting any particular piece of land in a visible way. Tractor changes it.

Commercial structures create, will say, expectations of the kind "how much", and push toward increased use of the resources, and desire for a return. Try and see how few chickens you can raise in human conditions, and that see if a few more will kick you out of balance. This will tell you the best number.

for happy chickens
Arina



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