permaculture

[warwick@bettong.eepo.dialix.oz.au (Warwick Rowell)]

To: vic,darren
Cc: london@sunsite.unc.edu
 
Subject: Re: Getting started... (fwd)

Larry, could you subscribe me to permaculture-mg please.
I have not been receiving any feed although I thought I had followed
the instructions you sent me about two months ago. Help! Thanks.

>I have thought about this myself and the newsgroup name:
>alt.agriculture.permaculture seems appropriate. If you or someone else 
>will write the statement of purpose for the group I'll have the newsgroup 
>formed here at my newssite.

I would suggest most strongly that alt.permaculture or alt.pc is 
more appropriate that any other title. If in due course there 
comes to be enough traffic to warrant it, then there might be a 
subgroups(s); 
                alt.pc.farm.dry.temp,
                alt.pc.farm.tropic,
                alt.pc.village, 
                alt.pc.money, 
                alt.pc.smallanimal, 
                alt.pc.backyard. 
                alt.pc.zone0
                etc

It might be that other extant groups overlap with one of these 
sub-categories. In which case we use either name for a double
access pathway (??sounds about right)

Pc is a generic approach to a variety of human and biological 
systems that looks at the system as a whole first. Let's start 
inclusive.

>alt.sustainable.agriculture is currently being used for that 
purpose; of course, permaculture-related articles appear in 
sanet-mg, alt.agriculture.misc, and elsewhere.
>
>> I know there is an FAQ being worked on for a WEB server, as 
we are well down that track in Perth Western Australia.

Well, actually, we (EEPO) have a front page, and have started to 
talk about a Pc FAQ.. we have nowhere near the setup Larry has. 

>I have a permaculture information Gopher here at sunSITE. I'd 
>like to archive your FAQ when it's completed. Several of are 
>working on one here in the U.S.
>
>> This will help cater for people who are in the GETTING STARTED 
>> field as well as a forum to network more Permaculture.

I would see it working much better as a directory service. The FAQ, 
and the occasional chat between people who know, and a directory
of contacts seems more appropriate to me that the building of an 
expert system.

There are too many variables, and the intellectual task of 
codifying and compiling it all is immense. 

Then there is the much more important task of implementing each 
bit you learn.. 

Slowly slowly, knowing that it will take four lifetimes to 
start to understand it.. with enthusiasm!

Pc IS about building a culture, of grounded people, on the ground.
So let's use this medium as just that - a linking, an agent for
introductions. 

We must remember Bill's injunction about work-netting, not 
net-working. This is hard for us e-mailers..
>
>It would be a big help in answering questions about permaculture 
>that arise on the net. The regular posting of FAQs would be an 
>important part of educating the public.
>
Disagree - delete "important part of" and insert "starting point 
for" 
>
>This is the reply I got to the letter I posted to Perma recently.
>Please  think about the idea and let us know  your ideas.
>
> Do you want this to be an open permaculture list???

For others, an open list is one that anyone on the internet can 
subscribe to, at any time, for no fee. 

My view is that it could start that way, but that it would 
probably develop quickly into an honest sampling that invites 
people to subscribe to an electronic "magazine". 

An open list is like asking Bill to make the Designers Manual 
(with a better index!) available free of charge. This is 
unrealistic.

All my experience suggests that people do not place much value 
on stuff they get for free. Or that the people who do value it 
are most likely to be the ones who can afford to pay for it..  

I have now been placing my expensively accumulated knowledge on 
the net in rec.gardens and alt.sustainable.agriculture "free" for
two reasons. One is to balance out the contribution I have received
from others that I value - a reciprocation that I regard as an 
ethical way to conduct myself.  The other is to quietly "market" 
my viewpoint and my knowledge, so something like the subscription 
magazine would not be launched "cold".

There is a growing group of people attempting to make a modest 
livelihood from Pc education and design services, and we should 
expect to pay them for their accumulated knowledge and experience.


>We would provide a cache on the web for the Permaculture FAQ's, 
>as they are developed. (I think)
>
 _____________________________________________________________
|              warwick.rowell@eepo.dialix.oz.au               |
|                                                             |
|    Management Consultant      Permaculture Designer         |
|__"Helping Managers Learn"____"Helping Land Managers Learn"__|


--
 _____________________________________________________________
|              warwick.rowell@eepo.dialix.oz.au               |
|                                                             |
|    Management Consultant      Permaculture Designer         |
|__"Helping Managers Learn"____"Helping Land Managers Learn"__|